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Post by danjimaru on Jul 8, 2014 4:29:48 GMT -5
I think the metal tracks that let the walls glide up and down in the newer version are wider and/or modified, because even though it's 30kg it looks much harder to lift. At 50 kg even the slightest difference in the tracks of a smith machine makes the weight much harder to lift.
Compared with the wall lifts from before in the last few competitions it seems harder to clear this obstacle, even if you take the effort needed to clear the backstream into consideration.
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Post by Sasuke Mania on Jul 12, 2014 20:28:02 GMT -5
The Wall Lifting is more harder than the Passing Wall due to the weights: 30 KG (66 LBS) 40 KG (88 LBS) 50 KG (110 LBS) Those are scary weights. Especially for Yamamoto. One lift of a Wall and he might have to forfiet due to a dislocated shoulder again.
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Post by LusitaniaAngel313 on Jul 12, 2014 20:32:57 GMT -5
The Wall Lifting is more harder than the Passing Wall due to the weights: 30 KG (66 LBS)40 KG (88 LBS)50 KG (110 LBS)Those are scary weights. Especially for Yamamoto. One lift of a Wall and he might have to forfiet due to a dislocated shoulder again.I hate to be reminded of Yamamoto and his shoulder but it's true. It can easily happen with those weights so that's why he usually lifts them up not all the way up and slides under which usually works except... in 13 and 23. 23 he made it out but his shoulder dislocates soon after...
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Post by RiderLeangle on Jul 12, 2014 20:33:49 GMT -5
You do realize the first wall of the Passing Wall was 30kg (66lbs) and the third wall was 50kg (110lbs) as well right...
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Post by Oti on Jul 13, 2014 20:44:13 GMT -5
30 KG (66 LBS)40 KG (88 LBS)50 KG (110 LBS)Those are scary weights. No.
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Post by LusitaniaAngel313 on Jul 13, 2014 20:50:32 GMT -5
30 KG (66 LBS)40 KG (88 LBS)50 KG (110 LBS)Those are scary weights. No. they're scary for me. I can barely lift 45lb.!
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Post by Oti on Jul 13, 2014 21:05:32 GMT -5
You're not a competitive athlete, so that's ok. If you ever did decide to compete, you would (hopefully) train to get stronger.
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Post by LusitaniaAngel313 on Jul 13, 2014 21:15:30 GMT -5
You're not a competitive athlete, so that's ok. If you ever did decide to compete, you would (hopefully) train to get stronger. I probably would. I have attempted to lift more than just 45 pounds but it was a bit much. I'll work on it so as it'll become easier. But yeah I think the wall lifting makes more sense.
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Post by wrestlingfan55 on Jul 14, 2014 9:51:11 GMT -5
30 KG (66 LBS)40 KG (88 LBS)50 KG (110 LBS)Those are scary weights. No. It is after doing all those obstacles before it under a time limit, I imagine.
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Post by Oti on Jul 14, 2014 10:58:41 GMT -5
I agree that the competitors are tired, especially after the backstream. But seeing so many of them struggle with these weights is proof that none of them are brutally strong like they ought to be. That is not a lot of weight, even when you are tired. I hope those who struggled/failed the walls will adjust their training accordingly and come back stronger, like Levi did in Sasuke 23. He struggled to lift the walls in 20 and then murdered them when he got back to them in 23.
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Post by LusitaniaAngel313 on Jul 14, 2014 11:00:29 GMT -5
Someone else who I'm sure will be training for this obstacle as well has to be Shingo... I mean... GAH SASUKE 23 that secretly hurt his shoulder to the point that it dislocated upon getting into the 3rd stage!
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Post by Oti on Jul 14, 2014 12:00:59 GMT -5
It's not a matter of being trained for the obstacle. It's actual raw strength and conditioning. GPP. General physical preparedness. A lot of competitors lack it because they focus too much on replica training. That's true of ANW competitors as well. You can always tell the guys who are legitimately STRONG because they crush things like a 50 kg wall lift.
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Post by danjimaru on Jul 14, 2014 12:10:18 GMT -5
That is not a lot of weight, even when you are tired. It's one thing to clean and press 50kg on a barbell and another to lift something that is gliding fixed on a vertical pathway. I can clean and press upwards of 80 kg but pulling the bar on a Smithmachine loaded with 40kg to the top is pretty hard and requires a lot of cheating motion (e.g. you can hurt yourself easily by jerking on it) and that is a bar that you can grip unlike a wall... I've been training with wheights for quite some time now and these wheights 30, 40, 50 kg are VERY HEAVY to lift in sequence btw I can deadlift 160 kg without gloves or straps
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arsenette
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Post by arsenette on Jul 14, 2014 12:18:46 GMT -5
I think the most recent problems with the walls (any of them) is that everyone has a shorter time to finish the course so they blow their energy swimming, then realize they screwed up with their time management then scramble, soaked and wet, with knee and elbow pads falling off them, goggles limiting their eyesight, sliding all over the place with 10-20 seconds to lift 3 walls with slippery shoes. Regardless of the weight of each wall and in regardless of the orientation of the walls, they are going to fail them or try to get through them by any means necessary to clear the stage.
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nehcney
Satō Hiromichi
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Post by nehcney on Jul 14, 2014 14:47:42 GMT -5
I had the opportunity to test the wall lifts in Vegas last year. danjimaru is right, the fact that they are walls and on tracks and not-the-best gripping surface makes them much harder than free weights. I'm not the strongest guy in the world but when I tried them I could do 200 lb squats no problem. Those walls were tough as hell. Especially after completing the rest of stage 2.
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Post by Oti on Jul 14, 2014 17:28:56 GMT -5
That is not a lot of weight, even when you are tired. It's one thing to clean and press 50kg on a barbell and another to lift something that is gliding fixed on a vertical pathway. I can clean and press upwards of 80 kg but pulling the bar on a Smithmachine loaded with 40kg to the top is pretty hard and requires a lot of cheating motion (e.g. you can hurt yourself easily by jerking on it) and that is a bar that you can grip unlike a wall... I've been training with wheights for quite some time now and these wheights 30, 40, 50 kg are VERY HEAVY to lift in sequence btw I can deadlift 160 kg without gloves or straps I used to play with a loaded smith machine just like you described, except I did not grip the entire bar. I treated it like a wall. None of that matters, but yes, I know what you're saying. What I'm saying is that those weights really are not heavy if you are fairly strong and conditioned. Yes, the walls are harder at the end of stage two and they are harder because of less than optimal conditions like Arsenette pointed out. But they were ninja killers because the competitors really seemed to be weak this competition compared to past performances/competitors in the past. They struggled. They collapsed. They were completely gassed. Something was definitely off with them. The backstream was a factor, yes. But it wouldn't have killed them so much if they were stronger and better conditioned. I had the opportunity to test the wall lifts in Vegas last year. danjimaru is right, the fact that they are walls and on tracks and not-the-best gripping surface makes them much harder than free weights. I'm not the strongest guy in the world but when I tried them I could do 200 lb squats no problem. Those walls were tough as hell. Especially after completing the rest of stage 2. I lifted the walls in ANW4. Yes, NBC's walls are s***ty, and yes, that makes it harder. Being strong helps with that, however. Being strong makes things easier, and that's the basis of my opinion on this wall matter; the competitors seemed oddly weak this competition. On the other hand, get your deadlift to 225+ kg and then try to lift a 50 kg wall. It won't be hard. Strength is important.
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Lachlan
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Post by Lachlan on Jul 15, 2014 5:52:01 GMT -5
You're not a competitive athlete, so that's ok. If you ever did decide to compete, you would (hopefully) train to get stronger. I probably would. I have attempted to lift more than just 45 pounds but it was a bit much. I'll work on it so as it'll become easier. But yeah I think the wall lifting makes more sense. Actually, that is good for a non-competitive woman, the best I can do is around 70-75 XD, but then again, I am a male...
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Post by danjimaru on Jul 15, 2014 9:20:15 GMT -5
On the other hand, get your deadlift to 225+ kg and then try to lift a 50 kg wall. It won't be hard. Strength is important. I bet Kanno is the only one that could come close to these numbers. At the average height of 165cm and 60kg bodyweight that these competitors have even 100kg deadlifts would be pushing the limit.
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Post by LusitaniaAngel313 on Jul 15, 2014 11:25:32 GMT -5
I probably would. I have attempted to lift more than just 45 pounds but it was a bit much. I'll work on it so as it'll become easier. But yeah I think the wall lifting makes more sense. Actually, that is good for a non-competitive woman, the best I can do is around 70-75 XD, but then again, I am a male... true. Males can do this a lot better than me. I mean we got the all stars who usually lift the walls over the head (save for Shingo half the time... XD) and they trained for it.
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Post by Oti on Jul 15, 2014 12:30:13 GMT -5
On the other hand, get your deadlift to 225+ kg and then try to lift a 50 kg wall. It won't be hard. Strength is important. I bet Kanno is the only one that could come close to these numbers. At the average height of 165cm and 60kg bodyweight that these competitors have even 100kg deadlifts would be pushing the limit. Size isn't the problem. Look at elite Chinese Olympic lifters, or anyone down in the 56 kg class that matter. Smaller people can still be brutally strong, and they actually have an advantage in lifting, leverage-wise. The problem is that so many competitors neglect the basics like raw strength. 100 kg is not good, though. Not for a healthy adult male athlete. No. 180 would be really good in my opinion, and it would certainly make a little 50 kg wall feel much lighter.
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