arsenette
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Post by arsenette on Sept 16, 2019 6:16:12 GMT -5
Everything that is being recreated faithfully looks great. Obviously a lot of care was taken to make those parts as close to the original as possible - scarily so in some places. But I am not excited for the changes or additions. Nomura has proven himself to be a terrible writer. None of the top brass at SE these days came from writing backgrounds. They were character designers, fight system managers, etc. They only took the place of the directors once the old guard all left at around the same time. Once upper management changed, the actually people with experience writing stories all left in tandem. From the stance of my own enjoyment, I don't really mind because I'll just roll my eyes and ignore that stuff, but it will have an affect on people who are playing ff7 for the first time and think this is how the original was. In either case, after the disaster that was ff15 and Kh3, this will probably be the last in-house produced SE game that I buy. (For the record, I'm not against changing/adding things in theory, but I'm not excited that Nomura is the one doing it.) I totally understand and quite frankly I was appalled at the fighting mechanics change which was the core of the game. Since then with a CRAPTON of feedback (especially after KH3 debacle) they have corrected course. Naoki Yoshida from FFXIV and Dragon Quest fame is directly OVER Nomura now and Kitase is breathing down his neck. Those 2 were not around for KH3 so I'm hopeful. Having played 7 when it launched (as an adult..) I have no illusions over the story. It was one of the lightest of the series (8 is still IMO the worst in story) so even if they add from any of the spin offs (Advent Children, Crisis Core, Dirge of Cerberus, etc.) but keeping the main story intact (which I am seeing) then it will be fine. The fundamental difference with 7 over something like KH3 is that no one knew the story of KH3 but they know 7 inside and out. Kitase hired a TON of people trying not to eff this up because 7 means too much to the franchise and no mistakes can be made with this sucker. Investors have already breathed down their neck and the press just about crucified Nomura over the initial presentation when it looked like a KH clone.. When you have a normally passive press screaming down their necks accusing Nomura of doing a KH/FF7 hybrid and declaring Squeenix to never touch FF6.. you know he struck a bad nerve. Since then it's been 4 years and they reworked the whole system, got a watchdog in Yoshida to keep Nomura on track and we have a damn release date that seems to be well on it's way to being real. I welcome additions so long as they don't retcon major things (which won't be on this disk anyway.. cough.. Aerith RIP) and that sweet new Classic mode they just added.. OMG.. THAT ALONE has made me excited. I don't like getting carpal tunnel smashing buttons while playing my JRPG's. That addition alone is proof to me that they are listing to the irate purists. I'm no longer dreading the release and look forward to it now. I better be.. I preordered the 1st class.. Edit:
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Post by penguincatfish on Sept 17, 2019 15:33:07 GMT -5
Hot Lava, a parkour type game from the makers of Don't Starve Together and Crypt of the NecroDancer, is releasing this week on Steam. store.steampowered.com/app/382560/Hot_Lava/The theme is basically almost life-sized GI Joe action figures getting through dangerous courses. There will be a level creator with Steam Workshop support. Trailer from 3 years ago... Gameplay video from 3 years ago... One of their animated shorts...
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Post by Badalight on Sept 18, 2019 21:13:37 GMT -5
Everything that is being recreated faithfully looks great. Obviously a lot of care was taken to make those parts as close to the original as possible - scarily so in some places. But I am not excited for the changes or additions. Nomura has proven himself to be a terrible writer. None of the top brass at SE these days came from writing backgrounds. They were character designers, fight system managers, etc. They only took the place of the directors once the old guard all left at around the same time. Once upper management changed, the actually people with experience writing stories all left in tandem. From the stance of my own enjoyment, I don't really mind because I'll just roll my eyes and ignore that stuff, but it will have an affect on people who are playing ff7 for the first time and think this is how the original was. In either case, after the disaster that was ff15 and Kh3, this will probably be the last in-house produced SE game that I buy. (For the record, I'm not against changing/adding things in theory, but I'm not excited that Nomura is the one doing it.) I totally understand and quite frankly I was appalled at the fighting mechanics change which was the core of the game. Since then with a CRAPTON of feedback (especially after KH3 debacle) they have corrected course. Naoki Yoshida from FFXIV and Dragon Quest fame is directly OVER Nomura now and Kitase is breathing down his neck. Those 2 were not around for KH3 so I'm hopeful. Having played 7 when it launched (as an adult..) I have no illusions over the story. It was one of the lightest of the series (8 is still IMO the worst in story) so even if they add from any of the spin offs (Advent Children, Crisis Core, Dirge of Cerberus, etc.) but keeping the main story intact (which I am seeing) then it will be fine. The fundamental difference with 7 over something like KH3 is that no one knew the story of KH3 but they know 7 inside and out. Kitase hired a TON of people trying not to eff this up because 7 means too much to the franchise and no mistakes can be made with this sucker. Investors have already breathed down their neck and the press just about crucified Nomura over the initial presentation when it looked like a KH clone.. When you have a normally passive press screaming down their necks accusing Nomura of doing a KH/FF7 hybrid and declaring Squeenix to never touch FF6.. you know he struck a bad nerve. Since then it's been 4 years and they reworked the whole system, got a watchdog in Yoshida to keep Nomura on track and we have a damn release date that seems to be well on it's way to being real. I welcome additions so long as they don't retcon major things (which won't be on this disk anyway.. cough.. Aerith RIP) and that sweet new Classic mode they just added.. OMG.. THAT ALONE has made me excited. I don't like getting carpal tunnel smashing buttons while playing my JRPG's. That addition alone is proof to me that they are listing to the irate purists. I'm no longer dreading the release and look forward to it now. I better be.. I preordered the 1st class.. Edit: I just don't think Nomura quite understands why certain aspects of the game were great. Here is one example. Sephiroth in the original game doesn't appear until after you get out of Midgar. You hear his name throughout the story and it builds and builds until he finally reveals himself. We then get a chance to see just how powerful he is through an in-game combat encounter - a perfect mixture of storytelling and gameplay. If the trailers are any indication, they are throwing that out the window and showing Sephiroth extremely early on. I'm not positive on this part, but it seems like those voices in cloud's head are just going to be replaced by scenes of Sephiroth monologuing... The other interesting part about those voices was it was always ambiguous as to who they were. Even after playing the game multiple times, it's never 100% clear on who is saying what. Is it Sephiroth? Is it young Cloud? It is Zack? Sometimes it's easier to tell than others... but it's not like they just cut to a scene of Sephiroth talking. Changes like those are what worry me. It also looks like they are changing the cross-dressing scene? Originally, Cloud does all of that to save Tifa, but the trailer seems to show that Tifa is with them during that whole debacle. I could be misinterpreting the trailer, but that's how it looked to me. I was never expecting a perfect 1:1 recreation of the original, and certain changes don't bother me in the slightest or are even improvements (President shinra showing the team a hologram of himself makes way more sense than him showing up in person and risking getting shot in the head by Barret). It just feels like they are leaning a bit too much on the side of... "LOOK! SEPHIROTH! REMEMBER HIM?! HE'S COOL RIGHT? OOOH REMEMBER THIS SCENE? YEAH THAT'S COOL ISN'T IT?" Just feels a bit tongue in cheek. I don't want the general feel of the story to be lost and I am worried that's the way it's going. I personally don't care about the combat. I love both turn based and action games. FF7 has my favorite turn based combat, but I'm fine with replacing it as long as the action oriented stuff is done well. Looks a tad bland from what I've seen though. Hopefully positioning is a big factor and switching between characters at opportune times adds some much needed depth. Considering FF15s combat... I don't have all that much faith. SE is not Platinum Games.
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arsenette
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Post by arsenette on Sept 19, 2019 7:20:31 GMT -5
I just don't think Nomura quite understands why certain aspects of the game were great. Here is one example. Sephiroth in the original game doesn't appear until after you get out of Midgar. You hear his name throughout the story and it builds and builds until he finally reveals himself. We then get a chance to see just how powerful he is through an in-game combat encounter - a perfect mixture of storytelling and gameplay. If the trailers are any indication, they are throwing that out the window and showing Sephiroth extremely early on. I'm not positive on this part, but it seems like those voices in cloud's head are just going to be replaced by scenes of Sephiroth monologuing... The other interesting part about those voices was it was always ambiguous as to who they were. Even after playing the game multiple times, it's never 100% clear on who is saying what. Is it Sephiroth? Is it young Cloud? It is Zack? Sometimes it's easier to tell than others... but it's not like they just cut to a scene of Sephiroth talking. Changes like those are what worry me. It also looks like they are changing the cross-dressing scene? Originally, Cloud does all of that to save Tifa, but the trailer seems to show that Tifa is with them during that whole debacle. I could be misinterpreting the trailer, but that's how it looked to me. I was never expecting a perfect 1:1 recreation of the original, and certain changes don't bother me in the slightest or are even improvements (President shinra showing the team a hologram of himself makes way more sense than him showing up in person and risking getting shot in the head by Barret). It just feels like they are leaning a bit too much on the side of... "LOOK! SEPHIROTH! REMEMBER HIM?! HE'S COOL RIGHT? OOOH REMEMBER THIS SCENE? YEAH THAT'S COOL ISN'T IT?" Just feels a bit tongue in cheek. I don't want the general feel of the story to be lost and I am worried that's the way it's going. I personally don't care about the combat. I love both turn based and action games. FF7 has my favorite turn based combat, but I'm fine with replacing it as long as the action oriented stuff is done well. Looks a tad bland from what I've seen though. Hopefully positioning is a big factor and switching between characters at opportune times adds some much needed depth. Considering FF15s combat... I don't have all that much faith. SE is not Platinum Games. Kitase, the original director is the main producer (and the one you see in all of the play testing and presentations so honestly I'm no longer worried. That and what I mentioned earlier that they hired a LOT of people who have FF7 as their favorite series of all time. Most are younger than me and are updating the mechanics and story elements that were present throughout the whole series (Crisis Core, Dirge of Cerberus and even elements eluded in Advent Children (which technically takes place a few years after the end of FF7 proper)). Yes Nomura did go on record saying he was terrified to direct this game because of the expectations and the fact that he didn't understand what people wanted. But he's not alone anymore and people who have heard the complaints have taken over. The original team was fired, engine changed, pulled in-house because the other company just didn't get it. Now they are owning up to is and so far what I see is spot on to what an actual REMAKE is. It's not just a slap of paint and rehash of a 22 year old game. It's a re-imagining of a classic game to incorporate the knowledge of it's older fanbase and serve as a launching platform for new fans who have only heard of FF7 from memes. As for Sephiroth.. might as well bring the elephant in the room and put him front and center so to speak. This is a Midgar game. Hell we don't know when the hell Part 2 will come out so for a stand alone adventure it has to have its own story. Besides.. WE know it because we played the game over and over. We grew up with him in every game from Dissidia to Smash Brothers to Kingdom Hearts. Ignoring his presence would be pointless. Entire generations grew up with the spin offs and never the core game because the mechanics were different and the artstyle was oldschool. He's only a figment of Cloud's imagination anyway at this point so seeing him at the end of this game as the true antagonist of the game (because the point of the Midgar arc is to dispel who the enemy actually is) doesn't seem troublesome to me at all. He's eluded to the whole first disk anyway in conversation so why not see him the way Cloud sees him? If anything it muddies the water because the original 10 hours of the original game will be more fleshed out and the Sector 7 catastrophe will mean so much more to people. If anything seeing Sephiroth at the end like that basically "end" the ones who let the plate drop will make new people WANT to know why the hell he's so damn powerful and why is Cloud even hallucinating about him. It may even drive people to seek out the original game to know why he's so important if Shinra was disposed of with a single slice of his blade. Besides.. they are adding Advent Children's geo stigma thing and Sephiroth is at the core of that thing. As for the voices.. we don't know honestly. I don't see why they would erase that because it comes into play in disk 3 heavily... Having flash backs to me doesn't preclude the voice in his head. IMO obviously. The scene with the 2 girls and cloud are right before the train graveyard.. so not at the same time as the whole Wall Market adventure. As for Tifa doing pull ups when she should be in the mansion, who knows.. maybe we have access to wall market between missions with Tifa. Would make sense because the false sense of security everyone had after the first "successful" mission. Remember that one of the more recent trailers also had Tifa talking to Cloud in 7th Heaven and that clearly takes place at a moment of calm between missions. I don't see why they can't just blow off steam at the Wall Market proving that they know the inhabitants before the famous "omg get Cloud a dress" episode. Overall I'm happy with the most recent changes to the game. Classic mode was JUST added to appease people like me who prefer not getting carpal tunnel every time I want to play for a long time. It also screams that this game will have unlockable difficulties. I do NOT get FF15 vibes. I refused to play that game and Kingdom Hearts since I hate both of those play styles. This looks like a good compromise. Remember that every time they show the combat something is tweaked the next time it's shown. From all reports from the demo they said this is the completely stripped down version. Combos and limit break linking aren't even in the game yet and they are fine tuning that. Right now they are gauging the fan reaction and so far it is overwhelmingly positive. Far cry from 4 years ago where they wanted Nomura's head on a platter for messing this up.
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Post by Badalight on Sept 19, 2019 14:37:04 GMT -5
I just don't think Nomura quite understands why certain aspects of the game were great. Here is one example. Sephiroth in the original game doesn't appear until after you get out of Midgar. You hear his name throughout the story and it builds and builds until he finally reveals himself. We then get a chance to see just how powerful he is through an in-game combat encounter - a perfect mixture of storytelling and gameplay. If the trailers are any indication, they are throwing that out the window and showing Sephiroth extremely early on. I'm not positive on this part, but it seems like those voices in cloud's head are just going to be replaced by scenes of Sephiroth monologuing... The other interesting part about those voices was it was always ambiguous as to who they were. Even after playing the game multiple times, it's never 100% clear on who is saying what. Is it Sephiroth? Is it young Cloud? It is Zack? Sometimes it's easier to tell than others... but it's not like they just cut to a scene of Sephiroth talking. Changes like those are what worry me. It also looks like they are changing the cross-dressing scene? Originally, Cloud does all of that to save Tifa, but the trailer seems to show that Tifa is with them during that whole debacle. I could be misinterpreting the trailer, but that's how it looked to me. I was never expecting a perfect 1:1 recreation of the original, and certain changes don't bother me in the slightest or are even improvements (President shinra showing the team a hologram of himself makes way more sense than him showing up in person and risking getting shot in the head by Barret). It just feels like they are leaning a bit too much on the side of... "LOOK! SEPHIROTH! REMEMBER HIM?! HE'S COOL RIGHT? OOOH REMEMBER THIS SCENE? YEAH THAT'S COOL ISN'T IT?" Just feels a bit tongue in cheek. I don't want the general feel of the story to be lost and I am worried that's the way it's going. I personally don't care about the combat. I love both turn based and action games. FF7 has my favorite turn based combat, but I'm fine with replacing it as long as the action oriented stuff is done well. Looks a tad bland from what I've seen though. Hopefully positioning is a big factor and switching between characters at opportune times adds some much needed depth. Considering FF15s combat... I don't have all that much faith. SE is not Platinum Games. Kitase, the original director is the main producer (and the one you see in all of the play testing and presentations so honestly I'm no longer worried. That and what I mentioned earlier that they hired a LOT of people who have FF7 as their favorite series of all time. Most are younger than me and are updating the mechanics and story elements that were present throughout the whole series (Crisis Core, Dirge of Cerberus and even elements eluded in Advent Children (which technically takes place a few years after the end of FF7 proper)). Yes Nomura did go on record saying he was terrified to direct this game because of the expectations and the fact that he didn't understand what people wanted. But he's not alone anymore and people who have heard the complaints have taken over. The original team was fired, engine changed, pulled in-house because the other company just didn't get it. Now they are owning up to is and so far what I see is spot on to what an actual REMAKE is. It's not just a slap of paint and rehash of a 22 year old game. It's a re-imagining of a classic game to incorporate the knowledge of it's older fanbase and serve as a launching platform for new fans who have only heard of FF7 from memes. As for Sephiroth.. might as well bring the elephant in the room and put him front and center so to speak. This is a Midgar game. Hell we don't know when the hell Part 2 will come out so for a stand alone adventure it has to have its own story. Besides.. WE know it because we played the game over and over. We grew up with him in every game from Dissidia to Smash Brothers to Kingdom Hearts. Ignoring his presence would be pointless. Entire generations grew up with the spin offs and never the core game because the mechanics were different and the artstyle was oldschool. He's only a figment of Cloud's imagination anyway at this point so seeing him at the end of this game as the true antagonist of the game (because the point of the Midgar arc is to dispel who the enemy actually is) doesn't seem troublesome to me at all. He's eluded to the whole first disk anyway in conversation so why not see him the way Cloud sees him? If anything it muddies the water because the original 10 hours of the original game will be more fleshed out and the Sector 7 catastrophe will mean so much more to people. If anything seeing Sephiroth at the end like that basically "end" the ones who let the plate drop will make new people WANT to know why the hell he's so damn powerful and why is Cloud even hallucinating about him. It may even drive people to seek out the original game to know why he's so important if Shinra was disposed of with a single slice of his blade. Besides.. they are adding Advent Children's geo stigma thing and Sephiroth is at the core of that thing. As for the voices.. we don't know honestly. I don't see why they would erase that because it comes into play in disk 3 heavily... Having flash backs to me doesn't preclude the voice in his head. IMO obviously. The scene with the 2 girls and cloud are right before the train graveyard.. so not at the same time as the whole Wall Market adventure. As for Tifa doing pull ups when she should be in the mansion, who knows.. maybe we have access to wall market between missions with Tifa. Would make sense because the false sense of security everyone had after the first "successful" mission. Remember that one of the more recent trailers also had Tifa talking to Cloud in 7th Heaven and that clearly takes place at a moment of calm between missions. I don't see why they can't just blow off steam at the Wall Market proving that they know the inhabitants before the famous "omg get Cloud a dress" episode. Overall I'm happy with the most recent changes to the game. Classic mode was JUST added to appease people like me who prefer not getting carpal tunnel every time I want to play for a long time. It also screams that this game will have unlockable difficulties. I do NOT get FF15 vibes. I refused to play that game and Kingdom Hearts since I hate both of those play styles. This looks like a good compromise. Remember that every time they show the combat something is tweaked the next time it's shown. From all reports from the demo they said this is the completely stripped down version. Combos and limit break linking aren't even in the game yet and they are fine tuning that. Right now they are gauging the fan reaction and so far it is overwhelmingly positive. Far cry from 4 years ago where they wanted Nomura's head on a platter for messing this up. I agree it looks a lot better than FF15's combat and it's nice that there are options for people (like you for example) that don't enjoy the action combat. As someone who has played and enjoyed really good action games (anything by Platinum) this combat looks painfully basic from what I've seen. It looks less like an action game and more like a turn based game that requires you to pound the x button for 10 seconds in between commands. That's not an action game. Dynasty Warriors which is universally hounded as having the most basic combat possible has more depth than FF7 remake from an action game perspective. KH3 and FF15 are also bad action games. (Not bad because they are action games, but bad because they are poorly made action games). I wasn't saying the voices in Cloud's head were gone. We won't know until we play the actual game. Buuuuut - I'm thinking those scenes are being replaced by those Sephiroth flashbacks. In the original FF7, it's ambiguous as to who those voices are a lot of the time. If the remake makes it obvious through actually showing the person or even through voice acting, that kind of ruins that aspect of the game. As for them incorporating stuff from Advent Children, Dirge of Cerberus, Crisis Core... god I hope not. I don't like any of those. Those are key examples of Nomura not knowing what he is doing. I'm not a fan of massive retcons or them clarifying a beautifully ambiguous ending. Also not a fan of the characterization that they have given Cloud in anything beyond the original. No one ever gave Cloud that "emo" label until Advent Children and KH came out. It makes me worried that his newer characterization is going to influence how he acts in the remake. Am I happy that they have reigned things in and started over rather than pushing out a product they weren't proud of? Yes, but the fact that they had to do it in the first place is emblematic of a larger problem that has been plaguing SE for over a decade now. Something is wrong with upper management because they have problems with every single game they release. KH3 had massive production issues, took way longer to make then expected, and then was rushed out the door incomplete. FF15 was the same issue. Took too long to make, then they rushed it out and tried to fix things with dlc, and then they canceled their dlc plans. FF14 was a disaster that they had to remake from the ground up. FF7 Remake they had to restart... FF13 had problems too. Naoki Yoshida is seemingly the only person they have with a good head on their shoulders. I really hope they give him FF16. And I know changes need to be made since they are turning a small portion of a game into a full game. I obviously know why they decided to show us Sephiroth this early on. It makes sense from a business perspective. I just think it could hurt the story telling overall. From the looks of it, we'll see him within the first hour of the game. But I'll hold judgement on that point until I actually play it. I'm just worried, is all. Hard to have any faith in SE at this point. KH3 was looking good prior to release and the actual product was terrible. I'm not going to lull myself into a false sense of security again. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twenty times... ya know.
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arsenette
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Post by arsenette on Sept 19, 2019 15:44:09 GMT -5
I agree it looks a lot better than FF15's combat and it's nice that there are options for people (like you for example) that don't enjoy the action combat. As someone who has played and enjoyed really good action games (anything by Platinum) this combat looks painfully basic from what I've seen. It looks less like an action game and more like a turn based game that requires you to pound the x button for 10 seconds in between commands. That's not an action game. Dynasty Warriors which is universally hounded as having the most basic combat possible has more depth than FF7 remake from an action game perspective. KH3 and FF15 are also bad action games. (Not bad because they are action games, but bad because they are poorly made action games). I wasn't saying the voices in Cloud's head were gone. We won't know until we play the actual game. Buuuuut - I'm thinking those scenes are being replaced by those Sephiroth flashbacks. In the original FF7, it's ambiguous as to who those voices are a lot of the time. If the remake makes it obvious through actually showing the person or even through voice acting, that kind of ruins that aspect of the game. As for them incorporating stuff from Advent Children, Dirge of Cerberus, Crisis Core... god I hope not. I don't like any of those. Those are key examples of Nomura not knowing what he is doing. I'm not a fan of massive retcons or them clarifying a beautifully ambiguous ending. Also not a fan of the characterization that they have given Cloud in anything beyond the original. No one ever gave Cloud that "emo" label until Advent Children and KH came out. It makes me worried that his newer characterization is going to influence how he acts in the remake. Am I happy that they have reigned things in and started over rather than pushing out a product they weren't proud of? Yes, but the fact that they had to do it in the first place is emblematic of a larger problem that has been plaguing SE for over a decade now. Something is wrong with upper management because they have problems with every single game they release. KH3 had massive production issues, took way longer to make then expected, and then was rushed out the door incomplete. FF15 was the same issue. Took too long to make, then they rushed it out and tried to fix things with dlc, and then they canceled their dlc plans. FF14 was a disaster that they had to remake from the ground up. FF7 Remake they had to restart... FF13 had problems too. Naoki Yoshida is seemingly the only person they have with a good head on their shoulders. I really hope they give him FF16. And I know changes need to be made since they are turning a small portion of a game into a full game. I obviously know why they decided to show us Sephiroth this early on. It makes sense from a business perspective. I just think it could hurt the story telling overall. From the looks of it, we'll see him within the first hour of the game. But I'll hold judgement on that point until I actually play it. I'm just worried, is all. Hard to have any faith in SE at this point. KH3 was looking good prior to release and the actual product was terrible. I'm not going to lull myself into a false sense of security again. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twenty times... ya know. Absolutely hear ya. I was on the fence until last week. Now I'm happy with the direction they finally got into. I'll give them that much. Music is amazing and new with a splash of the old but reworked so it's a whole different experience. The English voice cast is completely redone to match the American release from way back when (that had no voices) so the new one will have it's own feel and perspective. Cloud is not emo like in Advent Children. He's an a** like he was in Midgar originally and snippy with everyone but Tifa. That is the original Cloud (in both Japanese and English) and not the Emo Advent Children one. Hell.. look at Reno and Rude. They have spines and actual physical prowess instead of the joke twins from the original and comic relief from AC. All and all I am looking forward to the story. The original is still there, updated to the point where a toaster could play it and is in every current system made. No one has to go dig up some PS1 and watch the blocky horror show. They aren't destroying the story either. They are starting fresh and looking into the story from a different pair of eyes and taking into account that the rest of us who have been playing for 22 years already know the ending. I'm looking at this as a whole new franchise. That's why the old Voice Actors still have jobs in the spin offs, etc. Remake is it's own spin on the same thing. While I hated the combat of Dirge and Crisis, it added a LOT of backstory for the events and characters that shaped the world. Hell.. from the trailer they added the Wutai war... remember that Yuffie and sidequest was COMPLETELY SKIPPABLE.. now they are making it part of the story which makes sense. I am assuming once we get to Shinra Mansion Vincent will also be non-skippable and important to the backstory of Sephiroth because of Lucrezia. Stuff like this is important to flesh out the story. FF7 is a great game and my favorite FF but it had a lot of plot holes that other games and media have fleshed out. I'm looking forward to having it make sense. Still, this is not SquareSoft. It's Squeenix. My only saving grace is Kitase. The original director of the game. Not only is he one of the only SquareSoft employees, he's the face of the franchise. So while Nomura gets the dirty work of doing the engine work and world building, it's Kitase who is hiring the men to keep him in check. Naoki's involvement was felt IMMEDIATELY. He's merciless and it shows. We have a damn schedule. TBH a couple of years ago I would have preferred Nomura be fired.. but now that no one else is touching it (I put a LOT of blame on DISNEY for KH3 because there were no SquareEnix characters in it. And 15 Nomura was outright fired from the project so there's nothing else we can talk about in terms of his involvement. Squeenix has been a problem for a looooong time.. but having SquareSoft back in control.. gives me hope. Battlewise it's a taste thing. I'm not a Platinum Games person (hands hurt too much playing their games) and it doesn't control like 15 of KH. I'm hoping an actual playable demo closer to launch will help dispel fears (including my own). I'm going into 7R expecting a brand new story with the shell that was 7's story. I want to be crushed for losing Jessie, Biggs and Wedge. I didn't feel a thing when the plate fell in any of my playthroughs. It was a reason to get out to the open world. Now.. they want us to know who was lost. I'm looking forward to that journey. P.S. Uhm.. FF7's ending is not ambiguous.. like.. at all. Midgar took one for the team and saved the planet as a result. Everyone else lived and Nanaki is proof since he was with the whole team when the crap hit the fan. I would suspect that the rest of the team also made it and lived their lives until their normal human deaths. Nanaki is just not human and thus the reason he was shown as an adult with his family. TBH it looked like they were setting up for a sequel that never came... FF has always been big picture so the ending made a whole lot of sense to me.
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Post by Badalight on Sept 19, 2019 17:57:29 GMT -5
I agree it looks a lot better than FF15's combat and it's nice that there are options for people (like you for example) that don't enjoy the action combat. As someone who has played and enjoyed really good action games (anything by Platinum) this combat looks painfully basic from what I've seen. It looks less like an action game and more like a turn based game that requires you to pound the x button for 10 seconds in between commands. That's not an action game. Dynasty Warriors which is universally hounded as having the most basic combat possible has more depth than FF7 remake from an action game perspective. KH3 and FF15 are also bad action games. (Not bad because they are action games, but bad because they are poorly made action games). I wasn't saying the voices in Cloud's head were gone. We won't know until we play the actual game. Buuuuut - I'm thinking those scenes are being replaced by those Sephiroth flashbacks. In the original FF7, it's ambiguous as to who those voices are a lot of the time. If the remake makes it obvious through actually showing the person or even through voice acting, that kind of ruins that aspect of the game. As for them incorporating stuff from Advent Children, Dirge of Cerberus, Crisis Core... god I hope not. I don't like any of those. Those are key examples of Nomura not knowing what he is doing. I'm not a fan of massive retcons or them clarifying a beautifully ambiguous ending. Also not a fan of the characterization that they have given Cloud in anything beyond the original. No one ever gave Cloud that "emo" label until Advent Children and KH came out. It makes me worried that his newer characterization is going to influence how he acts in the remake. Am I happy that they have reigned things in and started over rather than pushing out a product they weren't proud of? Yes, but the fact that they had to do it in the first place is emblematic of a larger problem that has been plaguing SE for over a decade now. Something is wrong with upper management because they have problems with every single game they release. KH3 had massive production issues, took way longer to make then expected, and then was rushed out the door incomplete. FF15 was the same issue. Took too long to make, then they rushed it out and tried to fix things with dlc, and then they canceled their dlc plans. FF14 was a disaster that they had to remake from the ground up. FF7 Remake they had to restart... FF13 had problems too. Naoki Yoshida is seemingly the only person they have with a good head on their shoulders. I really hope they give him FF16. And I know changes need to be made since they are turning a small portion of a game into a full game. I obviously know why they decided to show us Sephiroth this early on. It makes sense from a business perspective. I just think it could hurt the story telling overall. From the looks of it, we'll see him within the first hour of the game. But I'll hold judgement on that point until I actually play it. I'm just worried, is all. Hard to have any faith in SE at this point. KH3 was looking good prior to release and the actual product was terrible. I'm not going to lull myself into a false sense of security again. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twenty times... ya know. Absolutely hear ya. I was on the fence until last week. Now I'm happy with the direction they finally got into. I'll give them that much. Music is amazing and new with a splash of the old but reworked so it's a whole different experience. The English voice cast is completely redone to match the American release from way back when (that had no voices) so the new one will have it's own feel and perspective. Cloud is not emo like in Advent Children. He's an a** like he was in Midgar originally and snippy with everyone but Tifa. That is the original Cloud (in both Japanese and English) and not the Emo Advent Children one. Hell.. look at Reno and Rude. They have spines and actual physical prowess instead of the joke twins from the original and comic relief from AC. All and all I am looking forward to the story. The original is still there, updated to the point where a toaster could play it and is in every current system made. No one has to go dig up some PS1 and watch the blocky horror show. They aren't destroying the story either. They are starting fresh and looking into the story from a different pair of eyes and taking into account that the rest of us who have been playing for 22 years already know the ending. I'm looking at this as a whole new franchise. That's why the old Voice Actors still have jobs in the spin offs, etc. Remake is it's own spin on the same thing. While I hated the combat of Dirge and Crisis, it added a LOT of backstory for the events and characters that shaped the world. Hell.. from the trailer they added the Wutai war... remember that Yuffie and sidequest was COMPLETELY SKIPPABLE.. now they are making it part of the story which makes sense. I am assuming once we get to Shinra Mansion Vincent will also be non-skippable and important to the backstory of Sephiroth because of Lucrezia. Stuff like this is important to flesh out the story. FF7 is a great game and my favorite FF but it had a lot of plot holes that other games and media have fleshed out. I'm looking forward to having it make sense. Still, this is not SquareSoft. It's Squeenix. My only saving grace is Kitase. The original director of the game. Not only is he one of the only SquareSoft employees, he's the face of the franchise. So while Nomura gets the dirty work of doing the engine work and world building, it's Kitase who is hiring the men to keep him in check. Naoki's involvement was felt IMMEDIATELY. He's merciless and it shows. We have a damn schedule. TBH a couple of years ago I would have preferred Nomura be fired.. but now that no one else is touching it (I put a LOT of blame on DISNEY for KH3 because there were no SquareEnix characters in it. And 15 Nomura was outright fired from the project so there's nothing else we can talk about in terms of his involvement. Squeenix has been a problem for a looooong time.. but having SquareSoft back in control.. gives me hope. Battlewise it's a taste thing. I'm not a Platinum Games person (hands hurt too much playing their games) and it doesn't control like 15 of KH. I'm hoping an actual playable demo closer to launch will help dispel fears (including my own). I'm going into 7R expecting a brand new story with the shell that was 7's story. I want to be crushed for losing Jessie, Biggs and Wedge. I didn't feel a thing when the plate fell in any of my playthroughs. It was a reason to get out to the open world. Now.. they want us to know who was lost. I'm looking forward to that journey. P.S. Uhm.. FF7's ending is not ambiguous.. like.. at all. Midgar took one for the team and saved the planet as a result. Everyone else lived and Nanaki is proof since he was with the whole team when the crap hit the fan. I would suspect that the rest of the team also made it and lived their lives until their normal human deaths. Nanaki is just not human and thus the reason he was shown as an adult with his family. TBH it looked like they were setting up for a sequel that never came... FF has always been big picture so the ending made a whole lot of sense to me. Oh, I am happy with Cloud's personification so far, I'm just worried is all. As for the English voices... some are fine, some are awful (hi Barett). I'll be playing in Japanese. FF7's ending was supposed to be ambiguous. A big part of that game was the party debating on whether holy was even a viable option since it was going to "get rid of everything bad for the planet". The party wonders if humanity would fall under that umbrella (because of things like Shinra literally using the planet's life as a power source) and that by activating holy to save the planet, they'd also be getting rid of all humans as well. They decide it's their only option, regardless. The ending shows us Nanaki specifically because he's the only non-human cast member. We don't know if humanity lived, but the planet survived. That's all that mattered. It's certainly possible that holy had no affect on humans, but the game leaves that question unanswered. There were a lot of debates prior to Advent Children on whether or not humanity survived. AC answers that question, which undercuts the ending in my opinion. I know that just because we don't see them doesn't mean they are dead, but the game itself establishes that holy might get rid of humanity and then decides not to show any humans after it had finished saving the planet. edit: I looked up the pertinent info, for reference. Bugenhagen: Holy... the ultimate White Magic. Magic that might stand against Meteor. Perhaps our last hope to save the planet from Meteor. If a soul seeking Holy reaches the planet, it will appear. Ho Ho Hoooo. Meteor, Weapon, everything will disappear. Perhaps, even ourselves. Cloud: Even us!? Bugenhagen: It is up to the planet to decide. What is best for the planet. What is bad for the planet. All that is bad will disappear. That is all. Ho Ho Hoooo. I wonder which we humans are?
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Post by arsenette on Sept 20, 2019 6:35:27 GMT -5
Oh, I am happy with Cloud's personification so far, I'm just worried is all. As for the English voices... some are fine, some are awful (hi Barett). I'll be playing in Japanese. FF7's ending was supposed to be ambiguous. A big part of that game was the party debating on whether holy was even a viable option since it was going to "get rid of everything bad for the planet". The party wonders if humanity would fall under that umbrella (because of things like Shinra literally using the planet's life as a power source) and that by activating holy to save the planet, they'd also be getting rid of all humans as well. They decide it's their only option, regardless. The ending shows us Nanaki specifically because he's the only non-human cast member. We don't know if humanity lived, but the planet survived. That's all that mattered. It's certainly possible that holy had no affect on humans, but the game leaves that question unanswered. There were a lot of debates prior to Advent Children on whether or not humanity survived. AC answers that question, which undercuts the ending in my opinion. I know that just because we don't see them doesn't mean they are dead, but the game itself establishes that holy might get rid of humanity and then decides not to show any humans after it had finished saving the planet. edit: I looked up the pertinent info, for reference. Bugenhagen: Holy... the ultimate White Magic. Magic that might stand against Meteor. Perhaps our last hope to save the planet from Meteor. If a soul seeking Holy reaches the planet, it will appear. Ho Ho Hoooo. Meteor, Weapon, everything will disappear. Perhaps, even ourselves. Cloud: Even us!? Bugenhagen: It is up to the planet to decide. What is best for the planet. What is bad for the planet. All that is bad will disappear. That is all. Ho Ho Hoooo. I wonder which we humans are? You said it yourself "might". Aerith knew. She heard what was decided by the planet. She was the one that called Holy and succeeded. If she didn't pray for it, Holy would not have appeared.. Bugenhagen didn't know and that's why he was saying perhaps so many times.. Aerith was a Cetra so she knew the whole time. After she was killed she continued to live in the lifestream along with Zack and was talking to the party the whole time. So no it's not ambiguous. The planet decided because Aerith heard exactly what was supposed to be done and they survived. Besides Midgar was the only city to be hit sparing the rest of the planet. Nanaki didn't live in Midgar. If anything it showed the status of Midgar siting in a corner of the continent untouched by anyone. Remember when Cloud and Tifa were swallowed up by the Lifestream before they appeared elsewhere. As for AC, it made perfect sense to me and IMO doesn't undercut the ending. AC was made BECAUSE people were confused about the ending that was perfectly clear. I remember distinctly the developers talking about that and their utter confusion as to why people thought everyone died... As for voices Barret's persona is now based off of his American release from 1997. It has always been different due to localization so I'm not upset that it's the foul mouthed blowhard zealot that was in the original game. If anything it fits better. Even Squeenix knows it which is why they made that decision. The original gameplay trailer with the more original VA just didn't fit what they were going for so that's why they recasted to redo Barret to the way he was known to us for 22 years. We have options these days to change voices on the fly so it's neither here nor there for me.
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Post by Badalight on Sept 20, 2019 17:13:05 GMT -5
Oh, I am happy with Cloud's personification so far, I'm just worried is all. As for the English voices... some are fine, some are awful (hi Barett). I'll be playing in Japanese. FF7's ending was supposed to be ambiguous. A big part of that game was the party debating on whether holy was even a viable option since it was going to "get rid of everything bad for the planet". The party wonders if humanity would fall under that umbrella (because of things like Shinra literally using the planet's life as a power source) and that by activating holy to save the planet, they'd also be getting rid of all humans as well. They decide it's their only option, regardless. The ending shows us Nanaki specifically because he's the only non-human cast member. We don't know if humanity lived, but the planet survived. That's all that mattered. It's certainly possible that holy had no affect on humans, but the game leaves that question unanswered. There were a lot of debates prior to Advent Children on whether or not humanity survived. AC answers that question, which undercuts the ending in my opinion. I know that just because we don't see them doesn't mean they are dead, but the game itself establishes that holy might get rid of humanity and then decides not to show any humans after it had finished saving the planet. edit: I looked up the pertinent info, for reference. Bugenhagen: Holy... the ultimate White Magic. Magic that might stand against Meteor. Perhaps our last hope to save the planet from Meteor. If a soul seeking Holy reaches the planet, it will appear. Ho Ho Hoooo. Meteor, Weapon, everything will disappear. Perhaps, even ourselves. Cloud: Even us!? Bugenhagen: It is up to the planet to decide. What is best for the planet. What is bad for the planet. All that is bad will disappear. That is all. Ho Ho Hoooo. I wonder which we humans are? You said it yourself "might". Aerith knew. She heard what was decided by the planet. She was the one that called Holy and succeeded. If she didn't pray for it, Holy would not have appeared.. Bugenhagen didn't know and that's why he was saying perhaps so many times.. Aerith was a Cetra so she knew the whole time. After she was killed she continued to live in the lifestream along with Zack and was talking to the party the whole time. So no it's not ambiguous. The planet decided because Aerith heard exactly what was supposed to be done and they survived. Besides Midgar was the only city to be hit sparing the rest of the planet. Nanaki didn't live in Midgar. If anything it showed the status of Midgar siting in a corner of the continent untouched by anyone. Remember when Cloud and Tifa were swallowed up by the Lifestream before they appeared elsewhere. As for AC, it made perfect sense to me and IMO doesn't undercut the ending. AC was made BECAUSE people were confused about the ending that was perfectly clear. I remember distinctly the developers talking about that and their utter confusion as to why people thought everyone died... As for voices Barret's persona is now based off of his American release from 1997. It has always been different due to localization so I'm not upset that it's the foul mouthed blowhard zealot that was in the original game. If anything it fits better. Even Squeenix knows it which is why they made that decision. The original gameplay trailer with the more original VA just didn't fit what they were going for so that's why they recasted to redo Barret to the way he was known to us for 22 years. We have options these days to change voices on the fly so it's neither here nor there for me. I don't mind barret's characterization, I just think his VA sounds extremely forced. As for the ending, Kitase did say in an EGM interview that all of the humans died... so there's that. I don't mind either way, but the decision to not show the humans was deliberate. You can argue for either interpretation, but that's kind of missing the point. It was left up for interpretation which is why people speculated about it so much. If it wasn't ambiguous, we wouldn't be having this discussion right now. I think there are valid points for either interpretation, but that's neither here nor there. Again, I'm not arguing that they all died - rather it was up in the air and ultimately didn't matter since the goal was to save the planet, which they did. EGM: At the very end of FFVII, we see the epilogue to the whole story that takes place 500 years later, so really, you still have another 497 years’ worth of games and movies to fill in.... YK: Ha, maybe I’ll try to do that. In a way, I consider that epilogue to be the true happy ending of FFVII. Well, it’s a happy ending even though all the human beings are destroyed. [Laughs]
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Post by arsenette on Sept 21, 2019 7:49:55 GMT -5
I don't mind barret's characterization, I just think his VA sounds extremely forced. As for the ending, Kitase did say in an EGM interview that all of the humans died... so there's that. I don't mind either way, but the decision to not show the humans was deliberate. You can argue for either interpretation, but that's kind of missing the point. It was left up for interpretation which is why people speculated about it so much. If it wasn't ambiguous, we wouldn't be having this discussion right now. I think there are valid points for either interpretation, but that's neither here nor there. Again, I'm not arguing that they all died - rather it was up in the air and ultimately didn't matter since the goal was to save the planet, which they did. EGM: At the very end of FFVII, we see the epilogue to the whole story that takes place 500 years later, so really, you still have another 497 years’ worth of games and movies to fill in.... YK: Ha, maybe I’ll try to do that. In a way, I consider that epilogue to be the true happy ending of FFVII. Well, it’s a happy ending even though all the human beings are destroyed. [Laughs] Interesting about that EGM article (when was it published?) because all I read during AC was the opposite. Not from Kitase though so there's there as well. I'm curious now how they will end this version but we'd have to wait a decade for that. I don't mind the VA. It's very early on and they haven't had a chance to grow into the character yet. From what I hear of the VA's they said a few lines for the trailer and the trailer took a few of the lines that belong elsewhere to make the trailer story (which makes sense since a few people (like Reno) clearly weren't speaking during certain scenes). All in all it's a preference thing and I'm very happy we can change voices on the fly. All in all I am finally looking forward to it now that we have more options on gameplay (most likely because of the international outcry of turning a beloved turn-based JRPG into an action game) and they are expanding on the already established story. I already preordered and plan to buy the 1st Class. I'm actually excited seeing the TGS footage unlike other times I've seen the game. That's a far cry from 4 years ago where I was just going to watch the story on YouTube and boycott the game. Maybe with a proper beta you'll see if you want to play the game as well given your preference of modern gameplay over classic turn based. Considering it was never meant to be an action based game I'm okay with the hybrid they came up with to appease the younger audience.
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Post by Badalight on Sept 22, 2019 0:37:59 GMT -5
I don't mind barret's characterization, I just think his VA sounds extremely forced. As for the ending, Kitase did say in an EGM interview that all of the humans died... so there's that. I don't mind either way, but the decision to not show the humans was deliberate. You can argue for either interpretation, but that's kind of missing the point. It was left up for interpretation which is why people speculated about it so much. If it wasn't ambiguous, we wouldn't be having this discussion right now. I think there are valid points for either interpretation, but that's neither here nor there. Again, I'm not arguing that they all died - rather it was up in the air and ultimately didn't matter since the goal was to save the planet, which they did. EGM: At the very end of FFVII, we see the epilogue to the whole story that takes place 500 years later, so really, you still have another 497 years’ worth of games and movies to fill in.... YK: Ha, maybe I’ll try to do that. In a way, I consider that epilogue to be the true happy ending of FFVII. Well, it’s a happy ending even though all the human beings are destroyed. [Laughs] Interesting about that EGM article (when was it published?) because all I read during AC was the opposite. Not from Kitase though so there's there as well. I'm curious now how they will end this version but we'd have to wait a decade for that. I don't mind the VA. It's very early on and they haven't had a chance to grow into the character yet. From what I hear of the VA's they said a few lines for the trailer and the trailer took a few of the lines that belong elsewhere to make the trailer story (which makes sense since a few people (like Reno) clearly weren't speaking during certain scenes). All in all it's a preference thing and I'm very happy we can change voices on the fly. All in all I am finally looking forward to it now that we have more options on gameplay (most likely because of the international outcry of turning a beloved turn-based JRPG into an action game) and they are expanding on the already established story. I already preordered and plan to buy the 1st Class. I'm actually excited seeing the TGS footage unlike other times I've seen the game. That's a far cry from 4 years ago where I was just going to watch the story on YouTube and boycott the game. Maybe with a proper beta you'll see if you want to play the game as well given your preference of modern gameplay over classic turn based. Considering it was never meant to be an action based game I'm okay with the hybrid they came up with to appease the younger audience. Ironically I think he said it around the time of advent children... I think he was implying some sort of alternate timeline. Not sure! Anyway, I will buy the game. I'm just keeping expectations low so I don't get disappointed. Kept them super low for KH3 and was still letdown. At the end of the day, it will be nice to see my favorite locales re-imagined. Can't wait for Cosmo Canyon and Golden Saucer. Though, I'm one of those people that love the pre-rendered backgrounds and find the low-poly models of original ff7 to be endearing.
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Post by arsenette on Sept 22, 2019 8:11:34 GMT -5
Ironically I think he said it around the time of advent children... I think he was implying some sort of alternate timeline. Not sure! Anyway, I will buy the game. I'm just keeping expectations low so I don't get disappointed. Kept them super low for KH3 and was still letdown. At the end of the day, it will be nice to see my favorite locales re-imagined. Can't wait for Cosmo Canyon and Golden Saucer. Though, I'm one of those people that love the pre-rendered backgrounds and find the low-poly models of original ff7 to be endearing. Giggles. I wouldn't be surprised if Kitase wanted that ending and got overruled by Squeenix staff to make a movie. I'm looking forward to both of those as well. Though that's going to be a long way off.. I'm actually more worried about that since the open world aspect of the game will be a thing.. in Midgar everything is self contained.. as soon as they leave the world opens up.. I'm scared how they are going to portray that or if they are going to get rid of the overworld in favor of FF15 driving a car.. but that's far off still.. gotta get past Part 1 first. I also wouldn't be surprised if in a PC version someone mods that back in.
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Post by Badalight on Sept 22, 2019 20:46:22 GMT -5
Ironically I think he said it around the time of advent children... I think he was implying some sort of alternate timeline. Not sure! Anyway, I will buy the game. I'm just keeping expectations low so I don't get disappointed. Kept them super low for KH3 and was still letdown. At the end of the day, it will be nice to see my favorite locales re-imagined. Can't wait for Cosmo Canyon and Golden Saucer. Though, I'm one of those people that love the pre-rendered backgrounds and find the low-poly models of original ff7 to be endearing. Giggles. I wouldn't be surprised if Kitase wanted that ending and got overruled by Squeenix staff to make a movie. I'm looking forward to both of those as well. Though that's going to be a long way off.. I'm actually more worried about that since the open world aspect of the game will be a thing.. in Midgar everything is self contained.. as soon as they leave the world opens up.. I'm scared how they are going to portray that or if they are going to get rid of the overworld in favor of FF15 driving a car.. but that's far off still.. gotta get past Part 1 first. I also wouldn't be surprised if in a PC version someone mods that back in. If they sell the low-poly models as outfit DLC... I might just have to buy them.
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Post by arsenette on Oct 8, 2019 9:58:19 GMT -5
PlayStation BlogAnd they confirmed in other outlets that the image leak last week was real and this is the actual way it will look.
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Post by Anshin on Oct 8, 2019 13:30:36 GMT -5
They've said that the image leaked represents the devkits that they've sent out, but it does not represent the final look for the consumer SKUs.
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Post by arsenette on Oct 8, 2019 14:06:49 GMT -5
They've said that the image leaked represents the devkits that they've sent out, but it does not represent the final look for the consumer SKUs. Ah good to know. I do find it.. weird.. Not a deal breaker but I haven't seen anything like this before.
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Post by Badalight on Feb 4, 2020 2:41:23 GMT -5
Pretty major changes to the story present in that new ff7 trailer.
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Post by arsenette on Feb 4, 2020 10:43:51 GMT -5
Pretty major changes to the story present in that new ff7 trailer. Yep. I'm excited to see where it goes. So far from what has been said they are not relying on old stories (Like Dirge or Cerberus or Crisis Core) to flesh out the story. I'm intrigued. Still feels like the old but has new elements that makes me happy to play a brand new game. There's even a name for him that I've seen floating around "Jenovaroth"
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Post by Badalight on Feb 4, 2020 15:17:38 GMT -5
Yeah, the Jenovaroth thing is confusing because at this point in the game, Sephiroth should be the Jenova that he is standing in front of. The fact that they both appear at the same time doesn't make sense based on how the story plays out in the original.
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Post by arsenette on Feb 4, 2020 16:04:19 GMT -5
Yeah, the Jenovaroth thing is confusing because at this point in the game, Sephiroth should be the Jenova that he is standing in front of. The fact that they both appear at the same time doesn't make sense based on how the story plays out in the original. Going into Spoiler territory.. The Sephiroth you see.. IS Jenova.. Sephiroth was killed by Cloud.. The thing he's standing in front of doesn't have a head.. That is in the Crater with the body of Sephiroth (which was the last thing he was able to do before falling into the lifestream after Cloud stabbed him)
Same as the original game, she is able to manifest herself in any form she wants and since Sephiroth is controlling her thoughts (due to sheer will) he uses the image of Sephiroth to manipulate others around her using their relationship with him). That's why you see the POOF where Sephiroth magically turns into Jenova. The body that is still harvested for her cells doesn't have a head but it kept alive in the tank while her head and conscious is the manifestation of Jenova and Sephiroth throughout the game. Only at the end does the reconstituted Sephiroth appear thanks to the Black Materia.
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