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Post by Badalight on Apr 22, 2020 22:14:28 GMT -5
If it makes you feel better, I will list the things I enjoy. - Biggs and Wedge are obvious massive improvements over the original game. - Guard scorpion made me mad but it was a really fun and rewarding fight. The way they took what is essentially the tutorial boss and made him into this massive threat is exactly what I wanted out of the remake. - While I dislike some of the new versions of the songs, the way they seamlessly change based on what you're doing is well done. I always enjoy it when games do that. - Extra lore on where some of these enemies come from is appreciated. - This game does retain a lot of the goofy aspects of the original ff7. They certainly avoided just making this into advent children 2.0 (well, for the most part). They retain a lot of the over the top monster designs of the original. - The game is beautiful (aside from the n64 looking door textures). Kind of makes me wish they would've just held off an released it on the PS5 so the game wouldn't have to make any compromises. They pushed the ps4 to its absolute limit. - Like I mentioned before, the banter among the citizens of the world and the party members makes the world feel alive. - Contrary to a lot of people, I actually like what I've seen of Roche so far. - Darts were fun. Happy now? Additional nitpick I didn't list before: - Let me go down the pinball elevator! I can't believe they kept that in but don't let you go down. (Unless it happens later)
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Post by Badalight on Apr 22, 2020 17:23:28 GMT -5
Sorry Bada but several paragraphs of just pure rage is bitching. Nothing wrong with bitching you are expressing your utter disappointment. I don't agree with half of what you are saying but that's your opinion. You expected something that was never advertised at any point at any time by anyone and then proceed to express your outrage that you aren't getting it. I can't help you. If you hate the game don't play it. It's not going to magically change the further you go. Storywise Jessie has always been after Cloud but because the section was so short you didn't get much of an expansion outside of a few flirty lines. Now they have the chance to do so and they did. As for the other girls.. THEY WERE ALWAYS ROMANCE OPTIONS. That has not changed at all. Remember the cat fight at the sex dungeon in Corneos' mantion? Did you forget that? Tifa giving snippy lines at Aerith for invading her territory? The whole decision making for almost a full PS1 disk so you know who would show up for a date at the Gold Saucer? It's all there.. ALL of it. The only reason you feel this way is that it's no longer sprites on a screen and text. The girls are actually identical to their original portrayal. Remember that you can get Barret to show up instead of any of the girls in the original or even no one at all if you chose a certain way through several chapters worth of dialogue options. Sidequests are optional. You think it's beneath you don't do it. It doesn't affect story only romance options. 7 remake is not 13 no matter how you spin it. It isn't Kingdom Hearts. It isn't FF15. Thank. God. It's its own thing with it's own flaws and its own mechanics, flow and storytelling. The original people are remaking the game the way they want it. Hate them if you want to but it's their damn story. If you hate it just stop. Otherwise it's just straight up bitching because you didn't make the game yourself. Criticize it for camera controls. That's fine. But that is still a decision they made because it's not a damn action game. You got 13 more chapters to go and if you can't make peace with it I suggest you stop now because you'll only get more angry. It's not going to magically change because you hate it. THAT is why I am saying you are bitching. Do I absolutely LOVE this game? No. It has its flaws but I'm accepting that THIS is the game they made and the model of which they will make more. Expecting them to change anything because someone who wanted an action game when they already diverted from a turn based classic is just .. wow. You have known this for 5 YEARS. You refused to play the demo. I can't help you Bada. I'm not sure why you're getting so defensive here. I even prefaced everything by saying they were nitpicks. You are interpreting my tone as bitching. I am communicating my opinion on the game. There's nothing bitching about that. If I was going around saying "THIS GAME SUCKS. HOW COULD THEY MAKE THESE DECISIONS?!" That's bitching. Outlining completely fair criticism is not bitching. Pointing out that an AAA game in the year 2020 should have the option to customize controls is not bitching. That's not a "decision", that's an absent feature. Do I have to be gushing about the game for me to not be classified as "bitching"? You define my posts as "pure rage" and I have no idea where that's coming from. Are there any sentences that make it seem like I am raging? You've completely misinterpreted me. I bought the game to enjoy it, but that doesn't mean I can't take part in the conversation of pointing out flaws. This game, and no game, is above criticism. Some of my favorite games of all time are dumpster fires held together by duct tape. One of my favorite franchises is Earth Defense Force and those games barely function half of the time. I'm not hard to please when it comes to games. It feels like you can't handle a dissenting opinion. If you're enjoying the game, that's awesome. Really glad you can find enjoyment for a game you were looking forward to especially with the current state of the world. I wish I was right there with you (emotionally, not physically. Social distancing and what not)! I like the discussion though, and that includes both the good and the bad. Even Max, who you seem to hold in high regard, has pointed out many of the same flaws that I have. It's fair to call the game linear (which isn't even a judgement call on whether or not that's good or bad, just a fact). Perhaps it's not as noticeable in this game because other elements of FF7R are strong enough to distract from it. In FF13, you had bad characters, bad story, bad gameplay, and bad map design combined which served to exacerbate all of the problems. But it's not unfair to point out similarities between this game and ff13. Motomu Toriyama had a huge part of designing the core gameplay mechanics of FF7R and it shows. Whether someone likes those decisions or not is irrelevant to the fact that those similarities exist. In fact, this game was mostly made by the FF13 team - business division 1. And for the last time, I don't want an action game. I don't want a turn based game. I'd be fine with either of those options. I'm not sure why you keep bringing up the fact that I didn't play the demo. I am not having buyer's remorse. I bought the game knowing there's a solid chance I could dislike it and I was fine with that. If the game turned off 30 minutes in it wouldn't matter because I already made peace with my decision to purchase it. But also thank god I didn't play the demo because the demo covered my favorite part of the game so far. That would've hurt my enjoyment of the final product. "You expected something that was never advertised at any point at any time by anyone." Let's discuss this point more in detail when we both finish, but I don't really agree with this statement. They titled the game "remake" and there were plenty of conflicting statements leading up to release. They were not entirely forward with what this game would be. Some people think that's a good thing as they were able to play the game and be surprised by the subversions. However, it's perfectly fair to feel burnt by that decision. But lastly, you are totally off base on what my "expectations" were. The moment I saw Nomura was directing this, my expectations were firmly set. From day 1 I did not expect a faithful remake. I think you are confusing hope for expectations. I would have liked a faithful remake, but I never once thought that's the route they'd go down.
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Post by Badalight on Apr 21, 2020 19:20:17 GMT -5
**Map control/Gamestyle shift/dialogue heavy/linear** lol, I'm aware of many things. It's better I know now than experience them as surprises because I'd probably throw my controller and stop playing. At least this way I can go in with the right expectations and try to enjoy the game for what it is rather than what I want it to be. Totally agree with not liking the shift away from RPG style combat. I blame your generation. LOL That was what I was talking about when it came to mapping stuff. Because you don't have control over jumping and other mechanics you at least have the mapping aspect given to you. I don't play with them at all (mapping to buttons since I use tactical mode a LOT) but I'm confused as to what else you want to control? You can't jump natively nor can you punch or throw grenades.. so outside of not using the mapping to controller option I'm still unsure what else you want.. other than another engine. As for not being able to pull off combos I'm not sure what you are talking about. I still think you would have benefited from playing the demo. Hell look at Max's combo videos.. the stuff he can pull off with the combat I still can't do because I haven't delved into Normal or Hard mode mapping buttons. I'm talking about choosing which buttons do what. Why does square have to be my attack button? Why can't I change it to X? Why does dodge have to be circle? Any AAA game that comes out these days should have control mapping. There's absolutely no reason FF7 Remake shouldn't have that feature. This is a game on the ps4, not the ps1. Not only does this not allow people like me to customize my experience (and seriously, why can't you navigate menus with the analogue stick? That makes no sense to me.) It makes the game inaccessible for handicapped individuals who need custom control schemes. Control mapping is something most companies have been doing for well over a decade. While the video you linked shows an impressive knowledge of the combat system when it comes to strategizing, switching, and timing, that's not what I'm referring to when I say combos. I'm talking about combos in the traditional sense of an action game. Square square triangle triangle, square. Things of that nature (I know this isn't an action game, my point is that it should choose to be one or the other and I don't care which). I'm not bitching that the game has expanded content. I'm bitching that so far, most of that expanded content is not good. Mind you, I'm just starting chapter 5. The expanded portions of the bombing mission were fine (dodging lasers was kind of lame, but whatever). I dig the fact that they are trying to give more characterization to Bigs, Wedge, and Jessie. I don't particularly like Jessie's characterization as 90% of her dialogue is being flirty with Cloud. Granted, it's not like I had some huge attachment to the original Jessie so I don't consider new Jessie as worse. I think they could've done a better job though; especially when you consider all of the girls in this game are super thirsty for Cloud. If it was just Jessie, that'd be one thing, but this game is basically turning all of the females into romance options. Is that what we're calling good female characterization now - when their main trait is how attracted they are to the main character and how dateable they are? Am I playing a dating sim or the most renowned JRPG of all time? Scratch that, I've played dating sims with better female characterization. The side quests were extremely lame. Rescuing cats? Killing 10 rats? Are we playing an MMO? Jessie's sidequest was decent, but the motivation for doing it was pretty weak. I am open to changes! Like I said, when I first saw what triggered Cloud to think about Sephiroth my initial thought was "Oh, hey, that actually makes sense". It wasn't until the scene went on for five minutes that I thought "yeah, this is excessive". I'm not afraid of change. I'm afraid of bad change and I'm afraid of change that makes it a fundamentally different story. Yes, there were many many reasons why people hated ff13 and I'm not saying this game is anywhere near FF13 level in sucking. I'm simply pointing out the facts of where the two games have overlap. They both have a staggering system. I personally did not like it in FF13 and do not like it here, but a lot of people actually thought the staggering system was a highlight of FF13. As for the linearity, FF13 was universally panned because of it. Look at the articles that came out the week before FF13's release when the map layouts got leaked. The internet had a collective meltdown, and FF13's reputation never recovered from that. And I'm not really "bitching" about the linearity? Pointing out that the game is linear like FF13 is not "bitching". Calling it a nitpick is not "bitching". Expanding upon my argument because you addressed it is not "bitching". That's just having a conversation. Did I say anywhere that it's a travesty the game is linear or that it ruins the game? I just said it's a little disappointing that SE hasn't learned much since FF13 and it's not unreasonable to expect more exploration in a game that promised to expand Midgar. I'm not the only one who has brought this point up. In fact, despite the game getting really good review scores, that's one of the common complaints shared among many of them, so it's not just me nor do I think it's an unfair criticism. The game is literally called FF7 Remake. I'll talk further on this point once we've both finished the game, but calling it false advertising is quite fair in my eyes. As for whether or not I buy the sequels, I'll make that decision once I finish the game. I've been saying for years that FF7 Remake would be SE's last chance in my eyes.
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Post by Badalight on Apr 20, 2020 17:24:24 GMT -5
Meow Bada™ Uhm.. you CAN map the controls.. and hotkeys.. not sure where you are saying you can't. Yes the menu is weird when it comes to figuring stuff like that but it's definitely there. As for the slowness of some controls I hear ya loud and clear and I hate how floaty it would be.. like I have to stand RIGHT at the spot and not a hair in any direction. Where can you map the controls? The only thing I found was that you can change which moves were mapped to your quick selection (L1+X, L1+O, etc...) I haven't found anything else. Point taken. That's my issue here. Square Enix has been moving away from turn based games for a long time now, for some reason... I think they have this weird belief that people hate turn based games. However, they are also too afraid to just make a straight up action game. All of their attempts have been these weird hybrids. FF13, KH, FF15, and now FF7 Remake... If they don't want to make a turn-based game, then just make an action game. In my mind, this feels like a bad turn based game and a bad action game smashed together. It certainly is "unique" which has made it kind of fun at times... but more often than not it's frustrating. If I try to play it as an action game, I'm constantly disappointed. I have very little control over my character. The dodge is bad on purpose because if it were good, the game would be a cakewalk. It's not designed around being an action game. It's designed around building up your ATB bar and switching between characters. That's fine and all but... just make it turn based in that case. It's not like the original game was boring. You'd rarely be waiting due to the nature of the active time battle system. It was actually pretty stressful and engaging to navigate through the menus quickly. Like, it may not seem like it, but I am not picky when it comes to gameplay. I love turn based games. I love action games. I even love bad action games. I've played the Dynasty Warriors series my entire life and those games have less depth than a piece of paper. But as an action game, even Dynasty Warriors which has been the industry standard for "button mashing gameplay" has more depth compared to the action portions of ff7 remake. I just want the game to decide what it is and go for it. It doesn't have to re-invent the wheel, and you can still have a unique combat system as either an action game or a turn based game. Agree to disagree on the English voice acting. I am playing it in English though. There's too much dialogue in this game going on at all times for me to be able to realistically keep up if I played in Japanese. I love the banter. I just wish I knew enough Japanese to be able to play in Japanese. Sure, it was in the original. But this game has always talked about expanding Midgar and the story. They are turning a 5 hour section into a 30+ hour game. One would expect a larger world. They have done that, to some extent. I just wish it was done more and that this game wasn't constant hallways. You can say its context relevant, but what will the excuse be when the same thing is done in the sequels? This game is no different than FF13 in that respect, and FF13 got crucified for its linearity. I'm not sure why more people aren't upset with it here. lol, I'm aware of many things. It's better I know now than experience them as surprises because I'd probably throw my controller and stop playing. At least this way I can go in with the right expectations and try to enjoy the game for what it is rather than what I want it to be.
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Post by Badalight on Apr 19, 2020 3:20:25 GMT -5
Started ff7. 3 hours in or so.
Nitpicks so far:
- An action combat system with no combos and no jump button feels terrible. - Staggering still sucks. - Not being able to navigate menus with the control stick is very annoying. - Not being able to customize controls is bad. This is a ps4 game and it won't let me map the controls? What era of gaming are we in? - I don't like the new version of my favorite song. - Too many sections where the game forces me to walk at the pace of a snail. Either make it a cutscene or let me go at normal speeds. I hate holding down forward for 3 minutes while the characters are having conversations 15 feet in front of me. - The game is very linear so far. I expected the game to have more exploration. - I do not like the English Voice acting. To change the voice acting, you have to exit out of the entire game (not even just returning to the title screen works, you have to reload the entire thing. - The Sephiroth stuff so far feels like fan-fiction. Actually, the first few seconds I was like "oh, of course Cloud would have a flashback to that moment after seeing fire. That makes total sense." But then the scene just went on and on and on for like another 5 minutes. Good grief. - Why do characters need to act like I'm 5 years old? Yes Jesse, I see the stairs. You don't have to explain that to get onto the second floor of the building that I need to take the stairs. You certainly don't need to pause the game for 20 seconds to tell me that, zoom in the stairs, and then finally give me control again. - Did we really need to change the end of the bombing mission to make our heroes look like less bad people? I really liked how it played out in the original. We were terrorists - no bones about it. In this one our explosion was tiny and it was only because Shinra interfered that people got hurt. BAD COMPANY IS BAD. GOOD GUYS ARE GOOD. That gets rid of some of the nuance. - Was guard scorpion balanced with the thought that players would use items? This is a very personal thing, but I don't like using consumables in games. Man that fight was f***ing tougher than it needed to be. - Hitting triangle to talk to someone and having to wait like 15 seconds before the dialogue starts because your teammates aren't in the perfect position, or something. Happens to much and it makes me angry. - Why do I have to crawl underneath so many thins and scoot past so many barriers? - Saving takes like an entire minute, I swear. - These god awful side quests. Saving cats? Really? - Man the girls are THIRSTY in this game. In the original, Tifa's main motivation for being close to Cloud was because his story of the past didn't line up. They weren't super great childhood friends. She's acting like we were BFFs. And Jesse is just... wow. Chill girl. - The dodge is pretty much useless.
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Post by Badalight on Apr 10, 2020 15:54:39 GMT -5
Nah, too busy this week. Gonna try to start next Wednesday or so. I did end up picking up a copy today.
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Post by Badalight on Apr 10, 2020 14:31:14 GMT -5
Talk about subtlety ^
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Post by Badalight on Apr 8, 2020 17:02:48 GMT -5
I hope you're right, but if they do screw with the story don't say I didn't warn ya. I do not trust Nomura. That dude has burned me more times than I can count. Have you played Kingdom Hearts?
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Post by Badalight on Apr 8, 2020 12:01:10 GMT -5
So seeing as how you said you've been watching the trailers... did you watch the most recent trailer? And what do you think about the last few seconds of it? The uh.. Absolutely that's is definitely Zack reference ? I suspect a lot of dream sequences instead of "the voice". Seems they are going down a totally different path and setting up more stuff for the other games. In the end I think it's good they are diverting from the path a bit and adding to what we already know. If they stayed on a straight path there's nothing to look forward to for us vets and we won't theory craft. Hell that trailer alone there's a BUNCH of theory crafting. We don't know for sure.. but we know.. but how the hell are they going to do that.. to it was him.. no it was him.. why are they showing that.. is that the lifrestream.. is that a dream.. is that the last frame of the game.. is that way in the beginning.. is that when he was talking to Tifa and he thought it was him but it is him.. but it's not.. see? I liked it. I did jump out of my seat when I saw it. I'm still processing the whole Barret/Sephiroth part.. because THAT totally didn't happen in the original. Checking my UPS tracking and my package IS in New Jersey so I should get it tomorrow. I plan on streaming it but will abide by the street date and probably play it overnight/Friday morning. Depends on how I'm feeling. I'll probably do an unboxing video for the First Class. Seems people like it. To me, the ending shot signifies that Zach is still alive. How would you feel if that was the case? I.E., this game is not only making minor changes but rather MASSIVE changes to the original.
If Zach is alive, that leads me to believe it's not even out of question that Aerith lives. This is fundamentally a different story.
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Post by Badalight on Apr 7, 2020 14:40:07 GMT -5
So seeing as how you said you've been watching the trailers... did you watch the most recent trailer? And what do you think about the last few seconds of it?
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Post by Badalight on Apr 7, 2020 10:49:05 GMT -5
Nope. I was avoiding it. FF13 is my least favorite FF so anything taken from that game is a big no-no for me. I was trying to avoid spoilers but the internet basically made that impossible. I also didn't think there'd be much to spoil about a remake, but I've been constantly proven wrong on that front. It doesn't feel like 13 at all (I played it up to Grand Pulse in the first game and that's it). I'm avoiding gameplay and reading YouTube videos. I only watch the official stuff so I've played the demo and watched the videos they produced. I can't wait. It's a new game and a lot of new story. If it doesn't feel like ff13, that's good. I'm a lot less worried about the gameplay than I am the story, but for an "action game" it looks incredibly button mashy. Doesn't look like it has nearly the depth as say, a Devil May Cry.
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Post by Badalight on Apr 6, 2020 14:20:29 GMT -5
Oh god, I didn't realize the stagger system from FF13 was brought back. Ah I see you didn't play the demo? My game is shipped and I get it later this week. I'm avoiding the full gameplays. I did watch the final trailer though. Nope. I was avoiding it. FF13 is my least favorite FF so anything taken from that game is a big no-no for me. I was trying to avoid spoilers but the internet basically made that impossible. I also didn't think there'd be much to spoil about a remake, but I've been constantly proven wrong on that front.
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Post by Badalight on Apr 6, 2020 10:54:43 GMT -5
Oh god, I didn't realize the stagger system from FF13 was brought back.
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Post by Badalight on Mar 29, 2020 22:11:14 GMT -5
FF7 street date broken. Watch for spoilers.
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Post by Badalight on Mar 5, 2020 23:44:41 GMT -5
Oh damnit. I forgot day light's savings time was a thing. First time being in America during it in 3 years.
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Post by Badalight on Feb 26, 2020 15:51:28 GMT -5
I've gone back and forth. Originally I wanted one for smash brothers, but that's really something to play with friends and my friends already have it. So no reason to buy it.
Then I wanted Pokemon, but I'm unhappy with GameFreak and the games look bad. So no on that one as well.
I'd like to play Fire Emblem, but I can't justify buying a console for one game.
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Post by Badalight on Feb 21, 2020 12:56:09 GMT -5
Not trying to convince you. Just giving my opinion, which is perfectly valid. "Adding instruments" is not necessarily a net positive, so I'm not sure why you keep mentioning that. If you think it helps in this instance, that's one thing, but just saying a song is better because it has more instruments is a reductive argument. If that were the case, acoustic songs would have no place in the world. Which people working on this song were involved in the original? I thought the main composer was the guy that handled FF13's soundtrack. "You are definitely in the minority in that one." You toss out the petty label and then you say this as an attempt of othering me. There is literally no way to prove this aside from anecdotal evidence. You have seen people praising it. I've seen people disappointed by it. It's a wash. Nor do I think that matters. This is my opinion. If I were the lone person in the world that thought this, it wouldn't change anything. That's how I feel about one song. I don't know why you're acting so offended that I am a little disappointed in one track. You act like an attack on this game is an attack on you personally. I'm not even attacking it. I'm saying I prefer the intensity that the original song exuded and that I feel the newer version is lacking in that regard. The songs are extremely different as well as the approaches. One is not objectively better than the other. Somehow you can't fathom how someone would prefer the approach of the former. You also keep conflating my opinion of this one song with orchestral tracks as a whole. Not only do I love the distant world songs, I've been to multiple Distant World concerts. I've shook the man's hand, have a selfie with him and have three autographs from him. I adore those tracks. I've said multiple times I'm not against what they're doing with the soundtrack in FF7. I'm just saying that for this one track, I don't feel it has the energy of the original. The examples I gave show that you can update the sound without losing the energy. I'm not dissing the approach - I just dislike the execution. Fair enough and I apologize for that. It seemed to me that you were against the direction of the soundtrack as a whole because they chose to erase the midi from the soundtrack. I am happy they removed the midi boing boing sound because it always made it sound cheap and for me it was the weakest song because it had that "I'm a midi" quality to it that was the only thing available to fit in a PS1 disk. I mean damn the amount they managed to fit in those disks was crazy and I still am floored at the impact even the midi soundtrack as a whole has 20 years later. I envy you for being able to go to a Distant Worlds concert. It's on my bucket list. SquareEnix Blog discussing the music ComposersThat last line is what I'm talking about where the music as a whole (ESPECIALLY the Mako Reactor) has the proper gravitas. I now know it was on purpose. Yes it is opinion on both sides on that one track. I'm just of the school that replacing artificial sound with real sound from actual instruments will always make it better. The acoustic argument you said works in my favor. It's a real instrument that is replacing the fake synth sound that a midi makes. I'm an electronica fan myself but even I know that when you replace it with real instruments it will sound completely different and arguable better than a computer generating a fake sound. I'm a huge acoustic fan for that reason. This Mako Reactor song having the layers of actual instruments and an actual choir still gives me chills and for those who heard it from the demo when that was released freaked out on the music on how totally on point it was. They never thought the Reactor theme could even sound that way and all publications I've heard and even anecdotally on comments from those videos and published articles all said the updated music made them more hyped for the game. If it lacked the punch it certainly wasn't expressed in anything I read or heard. You are the first to even suggest the midi was better. That's probably why I was so floored by it. You want the artificial taste rather than the fruit it was mimicking. Color me surprised. Added to that saying the music team made a mistake in direction was probably the thing that made my back go up. I took it as an insult to the professionals who went out of their way, who were there from the beginning, to give us a richer more layered version of the songs we know and love. Even if it was just the Mako Reactor, the thought that the fake version from a midi was acceptable to bring to a remade game with actual instruments. Yeah. I was pissed as a music fan. And the minority/majority opinion stems from the previous spoiler talk of where you kept stating that your theory was superior to mine because more people thought it. So blame it on that. Theory wise both could exist in the space and music so far you are in the minority from published reports and corresponding comments on social media regarding them. I wasn't trying to say my opinion was more valid than yours when I mentioned other people. I originally only brought that up because the complaints were the reason I decided to listen to the song in the first place (because I am trying to stay as spoiler free as possible). However, that was a conversation going on and I wanted to hear what the fuss was all about. I wasn't trying to say that was indicative of people's feelings on the soundtrack as a whole either (or even that one song). It was just what got me to listen to it. I continued to mention them just to let you know I'm not completely alone and crazy for preferring the direction of the original (I'm not defending the actual sound quality). The complaints also weren't vitriolic in nature or anything. It was just some people being a little bummed because they were excited for the new version and were a little disappointed in it. Mako reactor is not even anywhere near my favorite tracks from the original game. I don't have some weird attachment to it. Now if they ruin Cosmo Canyon... I might have to tussle with someone. I also said that my opinion on the soundtrack as a whole holds very little water since I literally listened to a single song. In no way could that give me an informed opinion. It just made me worried that the other Midgar tracks would be losing something in the transition to an orchestra. I said multiple times there are tracks that will undoubtedly benefit. I mean, as you said, listen to the Distant World stuff. I can't think of any duds there. Also as an FYI, I don't listen with headphones, so perhaps that would enhance the new mako reactor theme further. Also, synths can be rad. Susumu Hirasawa is a composer that basically exclusively uses synths and he's somewhere in my top 10 favorite composers. Lastly, I want to love this game as much as anyone else. Keeping low expectations is the best approach for me. Going in with high expectations for anything has never done me any good, especially when it comes to SE. I am nitpicking. I do wish one day we would get a remaster of the original game. Those remastered Crash and Spyro games that came out recently were amazing. There are mods than can kinda mirror that experience, but they have issues.
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Post by Badalight on Feb 21, 2020 9:19:18 GMT -5
I looked for the distant world version of Mako reactor, but couldn't find anything. Are you sure it exists? Also, I'm not sure if it's totally appropriate to compare Distant Worlds to the new soundtrack anyway. They're both orchestrated, but Uematsu's involvement in the new soundtrack seems to only be for Hollow and nothing else. And you can update the Mako Reactor theme without losing the punchiness and energy of it. Here are some fanmade examples that I feel like retain the spirit of the original song while still updating the sound. They're not perfect, but they show how you can retain the original feeling even if your goal is to orchestrate everything. The remake version just feels limp in comparison. You are literally wanting the "Boing Boing Boing" synth sound back in there? That's what gives you the "industrial" feel? Because they took that out and actually added to the track by adding about 10 more instruments, rearranging it to have several dynamic versions that change tempo and gravitas you feel it's "lacking"? I've heard differing tastes but that's just petty because they took out the boing boing synth sound in favor of instruments that are not on a midi keyboard. Folks doing this one were involved in the original even if Nobuo is not at the helm. No the Mako Reactor is not in Distant Worlds playlist but literally everything else is including a lot of synth heavy songs that used to exist that no longer are in that form for the past decade or so. You literally are faulting the current version because it doesn't have a boing boing in it. Wow. Definitely not going to convince me otherwise so no point in continuing that strain of thought. You are definitely in the minority in that one. A remake deserves an appropriate update to the music to go with the added story. They did that. Not trying to convince you. Just giving my opinion, which is perfectly valid. "Adding instruments" is not necessarily a net positive, so I'm not sure why you keep mentioning that. If you think it helps in this instance, that's one thing, but just saying a song is better because it has more instruments is a reductive argument. If that were the case, acoustic songs would have no place in the world. Which people working on this song were involved in the original? I thought the main composer was the guy that handled FF13's soundtrack. "You are definitely in the minority in that one." You toss out the petty label and then you say this as an attempt of othering me. There is literally no way to prove this aside from anecdotal evidence. You have seen people praising it. I've seen people disappointed by it. It's a wash. Nor do I think that matters. This is my opinion. If I were the lone person in the world that thought this, it wouldn't change anything. That's how I feel about one song. I don't know why you're acting so offended that I am a little disappointed in one track. You act like an attack on this game is an attack on you personally. I'm not even attacking it. I'm saying I prefer the intensity that the original song exuded and that I feel the newer version is lacking in that regard. The songs are extremely different as well as the approaches. One is not objectively better than the other. Somehow you can't fathom how someone would prefer the approach of the former. You also keep conflating my opinion of this one song with orchestral tracks as a whole. Not only do I love the distant world songs, I've been to multiple Distant World concerts. I've shook the man's hand, have a selfie with him and have three autographs from him. I adore those tracks. I've said multiple times I'm not against what they're doing with the soundtrack in FF7. I'm just saying that for this one track, I don't feel it has the energy of the original. The examples I gave show that you can update the sound without losing the energy. I'm not dissing the approach - I just dislike the execution.
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Post by Badalight on Feb 20, 2020 12:17:19 GMT -5
I looked for the distant world version of Mako reactor, but couldn't find anything. Are you sure it exists?
Also, I'm not sure if it's totally appropriate to compare Distant Worlds to the new soundtrack anyway. They're both orchestrated, but Uematsu's involvement in the new soundtrack seems to only be for Hollow and nothing else.
And you can update the Mako Reactor theme without losing the punchiness and energy of it. Here are some fanmade examples that I feel like retain the spirit of the original song while still updating the sound.
They're not perfect, but they show how you can retain the original feeling even if your goal is to orchestrate everything.
The remake version just feels limp in comparison.
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Post by Badalight on Feb 18, 2020 17:00:11 GMT -5
I don't know if they've been out for months... maybe unfinished versions. I know most stuff just got leaked in January because of the demo fiasco. Again, I'm not speaking about the soundtrack as a whole. I just agree with what I had been hearing that the new mako reactor theme is not good. Can't speak to literally any other song aside from the snippets I've heard in trailers. Are you sure you're listening to the real song btw? Can you link me to exactly what you're listening to? Youtube has a lot of fake songs and fan recreations. I've only seen one "official" one on youtube, which came from the leaks. Wanna make sure we're not listening to different things here. Because of no voice acting, we don't always know who is talking in Cloud's head since he has tons of voices. Sephiroth, Zack, and young Cloud all have lines. There are still debates about certain bits of dialogue that can't be attributed to anyone. But yes, it's safe to say Sephiroth's plan started before they got to the Shinra building. Sephiroth isn't running around though. He's just messing with people's minds from the northern crater, as he does for the rest of the game. I have no idea what you're talking about when you say "we don't know how he got there". He's at the northern crater. He can mess with people from a distance.
Anyway, I'm staying away from leaks but I heard from someone I trust (who has read the leaks) to not worry about the scene. So far from the trailers we haven't heard Zack yet speak to him. So I hear you on your worry that this part will be cut out in favor of visual cues. I doubt it though since the "voice" he kept hearing talking to him in a calm fashion really shows up in earnest after Kalm and that's clearly Zack. To introduce that would be weird now since the "voice" that Cloud is hearing in his head and "feeling" in Midgar was clearly Sephiroth. That's my take so far on that so I don't give it much thought until we see how they handle that portion. The game isn't even out yet so it may actually be there from the beginning like in the original. I'd personally love to see that as well just like you. It would make sense setting that up early until the reveal in Mideal/Lifestream.
You don't know he's not running around. You are assuming that. I don't know either. All I know is that he can assume bodies and shapeshift. Heck he even shapeshifted into one of your party members (whoever you had in your party) to trick them to giving the Black Materia they where holding to Cloud. As far as everyone is concerned (including his father Hojo), Sephiroth is dead and has not been seen "running around" or even remotely active since his death 5 years ago. That is spelled out pretty clearly in the original game. The anomaly was when Sephiroth showed up out of nowhere been for 5 years and that's why Palmer was totally freaked out when he "saw" him in the flesh (since he survived the encounter being no one of consequence to Sephiroth). Hojo who also survived was surprised to see him alive in some form (we don't know if Sephiroth paid him a visit or if he wasn't in the lab at the time he broke out Jenova but it's clear a lot of scientists were dead leading up to the blood trail) and he explained in the cut and paste I did earlier that he THOUGHT Jenova was the one moving and controlling everything. Then he realized it was Sephiroth all along not being content in the lifestream and ended up coming back up that day. So "WHEN" he came back is as important as to "HOW" he came back. I ask why then, why there since it's been 5 years since anyone has even seen him or heard of him. They thought he was dead. It was obvious he was already being felt by Aerith in the opening cutscene of the game (masterfully shown in the new trailer that she was communicating with the lifestream) before the first bombing mission. So my question is HOW he came back and if he was PHYSICALLY there or not (Shapeshifted or otherwise).
Remember that our disagreement is the concept that Sephiroth would be corporeal BEFORE getting Jenova's body as shown in the trailer. My contention is that since the original game (and subsequent games) did not spell out exactly what happened within that week (which I think was the timeframe between the first Mako reactor destruction (i.e. first moments of the game) and when the plate fell on Sector 7 and they busted into Shinra building and subsequently got arrested) there's a myriad of theories of where Sephiroth was at that time and if he was corporeal. There is zero indication of WHEN his murder spree started since blood trails started before they got to the lab where Hojo kept Jenova but way after the Reactors were attacked. Sephiroth was already being felt a week before (or whatever the time between the opening cutscene and Jenova's tank being empty) by Aerith and Cloud. We don't know if Hojo guessed anything or not but I don't think so simply because of the scenes with Red XII.
The other thing about the other theory you suggested (and is still prevalent to this day) is who opened the doors. This is what I mean. You mentioned that you think Jenova/Sephiroth opened the doors to the cells. There is no blood trail going into the jail cells. I contend that someone or something else opened the doors since the command center didn't have blood inside either. I only suggest that Sephiroth was already corporeal since everyone in the jail was already dead leading up to the lab. The blood trail starts after that when Jenova's body is commandeered. So if we mix both things together you could get that exact same theme in the current trailer of Sephiroth admiring the body of Jenova before taking it over from the inside. Because that exact moment in time was never spelled out in the original nor subsequent media we cannot rule out it ever have happened. So again, no I'm not bothered by Sephiroth in front of Jenova. For all we know that was a shapeshifted lab person he commandeered since Cloud was able to connect physically with Sephiroth's sword and be thrown back into the wreckage below in the current trailer. We cannot prove or disprove that Sephiroth was already corporeal. Only that the absence of that information will allow for all theories to exist.
The "leak" (from what I understand since I did not pursue it) had the full bombing run mission that included the E3 demo (albeit with full mechanics since the E3 version was the stripped down version) that Square later published on their website (just what was playable at different conventions). I refuse to look at the "leak" as well and avoided everything although from all accounts what was shown in the last full trailer all of the assets were shown already so there's nothing "new" in the demo that has not come out yet. They had files and screenshots of characters that are now public from the last trailer rendering the "leak' moot. There's a compilation of the music from the E3 demo from last summer that Max did on his channel. He talks a LOT about the music and shows a couple of the variations. That's part of what I was referring to. This video is over 5 months old and may be part of what you heard. Right before Tokyo Game show Squeenix allowed the NDA to be lifted on the demo from official publications so we know what it looks and sounds like. There's been more stuff that have come out obviously officially (I do listen to the fan renditions but I'm referring to the official stuff because just like you I want to find that out on my own when I play it on Day 1. That said I did download the entirety of the Vinyl tracks that are now public. I'm getting the First Class Edition that comes with the physical Soundtrack so I'm justifying pirating it since I grew up with Vinyl and I just don't understand the fad now. LOL I'm not a hipster.) but it's more than the original 1 track that plays through the whole thing. I did my own video on the battle music (from the Tokyo Game Show footage) that showed the dynamic additions depending on the summons that are out as well. At that time we didn't know how many new tracks were added but Squeenix has gone on record as to the variety of themes per section dynamic to the action of the player. Is is EXACTLY like the original? No. But I think it's better because it's a full orchestra playing the themes instead of the midi version you have in your mind. Even Uematsu whenever he did concerts used an orchestra on all of his songs and they sound amazing. All these versions do is add instruments and interweave more melodies and instruments (which sounds friggin' amazing). They also added new themes that compliment the original by mixing different songs together. The opening movie did that by mixing Sephiroth's theme with the opening sequence that appeared in Advent Children tying that together. No one I've seen, read, heard even remotely mentions anything negative about the Midgar Reactor theme music. Everyone I've heard (and I look at a cubic boatload of reaction videos on YouTube to bide my time until release) talk about the songs giving them chills and increasing the hype for the release based primarily on the music being foreboding and nostalgic at the same time. Everyone I've read praised that there was more to listen to than just 1 theme. Remember the game is a lot bigger so naturally more music has to be created to fill those out. It seems we will be doing a lot more in the reactors as well so it makes sense. The leaks are much more extensive than that. Most of the game script along with music tracks, audio, and entire cutscenes were leaked. I haven't looked into any of it myself for obvious reasons, but people essentially know everything about the game (or at least like 70% of it). The leak was not the demo; but it came from the demo. SE left a bunch of files of the full game in the demo (including the password to access all of the files), and people were able to see it all. It's not the entire game, but it's a very very large chunk of it. So be careful with where you look. But anyway, yes that is the version that I heard. My opinion of it stands. I love that dynamic nature of the music. That's not my complaint. I disagree with the direction they've taken in regards to the Midgar tracks (this is just my assumption based on what I've heard). They've taken out the industrialized sound of it. They've basically removed all of the synth. The new version lacks the impact of the original regardless of which of the "6 versions" you listen to. This is just one song, but I can make a pretty good guess that I will have issues with the other Midgar songs (which is the entire of this game, really). I'm sure stuff like Tifa's theme will sound great, as that is more suitable to a traditional orchestrated sound.
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