Stage 3 and the strength ceiling.

[sackeshi]

So I think stage 3 is in crisis, even if TBS decides to fully fund the show and allow for a true renewal I think we've reached the ceiling for the course on stage 3. With the new generations of under 30 competitors coming up and being able to train and get their strength to match the needs of the course its turned stage 3 into a technical course.

Basically every fail was a timing issue baring the pipe slider fail and Yuji's vertical limit fail. We likely wont see another tournament end on stage 3 again. Morimoto Yūsuke will clear the final stage on his second attempt always (unless they remove 5 seconds)

Stage 2 must return to its status as the hardest stage or we're going to be seeing total victories every other tournament from Morimoto Yūsuke

[dakohosu]

I think the main issue is that Inui wants Stages 1 and 2 to be relatively easy to allow for celebrities to get relatively far into the course and hence boost ratings. But then to counteract that nerf to maintain their reputation as the world's hardest obstacle course and straight up preventing multiple Final Stage attempts every tournament, Stage 3 ends up being made ridiculously OP. Inui is also clearly overly capitalising on the fact that Stage 3 had historically always been the most feared stage and so I think is overcompensating for marketing purposes. Most fans of the show are far more casual than us and so what draws them in are more simplistic things like how cool an obstacle looks or how much of a bloodbath a stage is, regardless of how poorly balanced it is which are things we tend to pick up on a lot more. Cliffhanger Dimension? It's a terrible addition that regularly malfunctions and shouldn't exist to begin with due to how Cliffhanger-biased the stage already is, but it looks cool with the moving ledges, so let's stick it in to 'wow' viewers.

I actually don't think Stage 3's issue is necessarily its difficulty per se. Sure, it is brutally hard, but I'd say more of the stagnation we've seen in results is due to the over-reliance on overly specific and technical moves, many of which can and often are failed in competition even if the competitor has trained relentlessly for them. Too many do-or-die transitions like the Cliffhanger, Swing Edge, and Spinwinder. I miss the time when Stage 3 was more of an endurance battle than anything. It was much easier to progress through training and was much more exciting to watch as there was more variation in terms of where people would fail, rather than always failing the Crazy transition even if you're incredibly skilled and aren't particularly tired due to bad luck or nerves etc. I also feel like there's a clear divide between who is and isn't capable of clearing the current Stage 3, which makes the whole thing much more predictable; like seeing Yoshiyuki and Tada make the Final Stage was great but I think a lot of people expected this. Having a more endurance and less technique-specific course that you can absolutely beat if you put in the hours kind of mitigates this.

Take 25's Stage 3 for example. It's still easily the most scary-looking Stage 3 we've ever seen, and undeniably one of the most formidable. But imo it's a stage that can much more easily be beaten through training as it's far more about physical and mental endurance, and less reliant on luck and RNG like the Dimension is, but is also hard enough that majority of weaker competitors will still fail relatively early on. It's also way more exciting seeing competitors battle fatigue rather than being fine up until the Cliffhanger then just missing the transition, as always. I still think the Vertical Limit should stay though, seeing the grimace of pain on competitors' faces as they hung on for dear life was such a dramatic crescendo to the stage - we need more obstacles like that, though maybe not as hard throughout the entirety of the stage lol.

In terms of taking Yusuke out, it's a pretty difficult one to call. He's untouchable on Stage 3 unless you want to annihilate the entire rest of the field as well. Imo the best strategies are introducing a new balance obstacle or slashing the time limit on Stage 1, or a more raw strength obstacle on Stage 2, but even these are based off of his fails from several years ago. He struggled with the Wall Lift back in 29-30 and now it's a non-issue for him. He just out-trains everything; even if something takes him out in one tournament he'll just come back with a vengeance and then get back to the Final Stage again. Besides, it almost seems as though producers want Yusuke to win a third time, as unlike previous renewals they're almost playing to his advantages at this point with the rock wall and more grip based obstacles on Stage 3. That said, Yusuke, like pretty much everyone else, has done pretty badly on a lot of the international spinoffs (except for on Stage 3, obviously) so if it were up to me I'd capitalise on the types of obstacles he failed in those situations, well, except for the height based ones (like the Butterfly Wall in USA vs World) as that would cause carnage among the average Japanese height lol.

[salt]

I mean, if they're reaching a limit with 6 obstacles, why not increase it to 7 or 8 obstacles? That's how it used to be until the RISING era anyways.

[dakohosu]

Jan 16, 2023 13:36:38 GMT -5 salt said:

I mean, if they're reaching a limit with 6 obstacles, why not increase it to 7 or 8 obstacles? That's how it used to be until the RISING era anyways.

'BuDgEt IsSuEs'

Allegedly elongating the course is very expensive, even though Inui happily did this on Stage 1 adding a second wall no one asked for.