The reason why trial results were bad

[brz0ny]

I decided to look back on the trials as I just watched last episode. Only 2 people out of 500 being fit to beat First Stage without toughest obstacles and Silk Slider is very disappointing, and I would like to look at reasons why.

First reason is obvious. They simply didnt pick the best people available. While I am not fully convinced better lineup would have drastically changed the results, it is evident that people like Sho who are actually more than capable of going far into Third Stage. However there is even a bigger reason, because I am not sure even if he was picked he might have failed trials.

Second reason and even more important reason were the challenges. There are several problems with them. While yes, more athletic people will do better, being able to run fast, have good stamina, do a lot of push ups and being able to push a tyre fast, is not very connected to an obstacle course. None of those 4 challenges actually differenciate who is better at balance, trampoline jump, parkour, or grip, and all of these are from First Stage alone. If all 500 were to do thw Final Challenge, we would have WAY more clears. Even then, we didnt even brush the problems like swimming, laches, climbing, and finger grip, things necessary for other 3 stages.

In short, the format was wrong. Cutting competitor number the way they did is fine, but the challenges were just too disconnected from real ones. Just remember trials in Shin Sasuke. Not only did most memorable competitors in recent years come from them, but they also included many challenges which had to do with what I named above, and therefore actually doing its job, discovering real talent that can go far in tournaments.

[sasukewarrior333]

We should've had Shogo and Washimi in 40, that was pretty disappointing. It's a darn shame.

[dakohosu]

Nov 17, 2022 17:18:25 GMT dakohosu said:
The fact that they rejected Sho Ishikawa as well as several other veterans who’ve done decently well, yet accepted 10 people, 8 of whom failed simple Stage 1 obstacles, tells me all I need to know lol, and supports my previous point.

Not suggesting the trials should’ve been some Cliffhanger Vertical Limit screw fest, but come on is a tire run or push-up contest really indicative of a competitor’s ability to perform well on Sasuke, specifically Stage 1? Imo they should’ve done Stage 1 replicas right from the start as that would immediately eliminate those likely to fail on the course and hence only those who would actually have a fighting chance at clearing would’ve made it through to the later rounds. Even throw a Dragon Glider in there for good measure. Some upper body stuff would also be a good indicator of someone’s ability to perform on the later stages, though nothing OP like today’s Stage 3. Maybe a Salmon Ladder just to make sure that said competitors aren’t Dai Igarashis who can reliably get through an admittedly easy Stage 1 but then just die on Stage 2.

For reference I’m not sh1tting on these trials specifically, all of the past trials bar Sasuke 13 and arguably 11 too have always had these dumb events which has frequently resulted in the best competitors (eg Yuuji and Yusuke) while most of those who do get on just fail Stage 1. General athleticism is obviously important but the course is so specific these days that people who actually practice specific skills and/or on replicas should be given an advantage. I get giving people a chance and all but if you’re going to have trials at least allow it to be an opportunity for rising stars to show their potential rather than just letting on a couple of fodder competitors.

I’m just glad Iwasaki got shortlisted to compete, because let’s be honest he probably also would’ve ended up getting eliminated in the trials just by virtue of how few spaces there were (3 out of 500).

Anyway I hope these two trial qualifiers prove me wrong but I’m not holding my breath.

^I literally made a similar argument on another thread. 

If two of your 10 finalists end up failing the Rolling Hill/doing worse than most joke competitors you know you've hired the wrong guys. It's like hiring a software engineer then asking him/her to write a basic piece of code and they can't even do that.

The only thing about your point that I disagree with were that the Shin-Sasuke trials were much better; in isolation, they weren't. They too comprised of sandbag throws, high jumps, and other fairly easy obstacles that weren't much more related to the course than the majority of today's trials were. It was clearly more that those who even got shortlisted to compete in the trials were chosen on higher standards, as pretty much all of the STQ-ers were incredibly athletic and ended up having great careers down the line. I'd wager a good 70-80% of these 500 would be Rolling Hill fodder, they seemed to pretty much accept anyone. 

Sasuke 19-20 is almost equally as guilty because they did their trials at Muscle Park so it was ONLY judged on upper body strength/Stage 3 ability, and given how many Stage 3 specialists we know who can never make it past Stage 1 that wasn't ideal either.

There needs to be a mix of abilities tested in the trials; most of the ones we've seen and certainly 40's trials haven't struck that balance. Sasuke 13 is the only one I can think of, mainly because it was an exact replica of an older Stage 1. Bit boring/unimaginative, but if that's what it takes to get the cream of the crop, then so be it. That is the inherent point of the trials after all.

[brz0ny]

Nov 17, 2022 19:48:48 GMT -5 dakohosu said:

Nov 17, 2022 17:18:25 GMT dakohosu said:
The fact that they rejected Sho Ishikawa as well as several other veterans who’ve done decently well, yet accepted 10 people, 8 of whom failed simple Stage 1 obstacles, tells me all I need to know lol, and supports my previous point.

Not suggesting the trials should’ve been some Cliffhanger Vertical Limit screw fest, but come on is a tire run or push-up contest really indicative of a competitor’s ability to perform well on Sasuke, specifically Stage 1? Imo they should’ve done Stage 1 replicas right from the start as that would immediately eliminate those likely to fail on the course and hence only those who would actually have a fighting chance at clearing would’ve made it through to the later rounds. Even throw a Dragon Glider in there for good measure. Some upper body stuff would also be a good indicator of someone’s ability to perform on the later stages, though nothing OP like today’s Stage 3. Maybe a Salmon Ladder just to make sure that said competitors aren’t Dai Igarashis who can reliably get through an admittedly easy Stage 1 but then just die on Stage 2.

For reference I’m not sh1tting on these trials specifically, all of the past trials bar Sasuke 13 and arguably 11 too have always had these dumb events which has frequently resulted in the best competitors (eg Yuuji and Yusuke) while most of those who do get on just fail Stage 1. General athleticism is obviously important but the course is so specific these days that people who actually practice specific skills and/or on replicas should be given an advantage. I get giving people a chance and all but if you’re going to have trials at least allow it to be an opportunity for rising stars to show their potential rather than just letting on a couple of fodder competitors.

I’m just glad Iwasaki got shortlisted to compete, because let’s be honest he probably also would’ve ended up getting eliminated in the trials just by virtue of how few spaces there were (3 out of 500).

Anyway I hope these two trial qualifiers prove me wrong but I’m not holding my breath.

^I literally made a similar argument on another thread. 

If two of your 10 finalists end up failing the Rolling Hill/doing worse than most joke competitors you know you've hired the wrong guys. It's like hiring a software engineer then asking him/her to write a basic piece of code and they can't even do that.

The only thing about your point that I disagree with were that the Shin-Sasuke trials were much better; in isolation, they weren't. They too comprised of sandbag throws, high jumps, and other fairly easy obstacles that weren't much more related to the course than the majority of today's trials were. It was clearly more that those who even got shortlisted to compete in the trials were chosen on higher standards, as pretty much all of the STQ-ers were incredibly athletic and ended up having great careers down the line. I'd wager a good 70-80% of these 500 would be Rolling Hill fodder, they seemed to pretty much accept anyone. 

Sasuke 19-20 is almost equally as guilty because they did their trials at Muscle Park so it was ONLY judged on upper body strength/Stage 3 ability, and given how many Stage 3 specialists we know who can never make it past Stage 1 that wasn't ideal either.

There needs to be a mix of abilities tested in the trials; most of the ones we've seen and certainly 40's trials haven't struck that balance. Sasuke 13 is the only one I can think of, mainly because it was an exact replica of an older Stage 1. Bit boring/unimaginative, but if that's what it takes to get the cream of the crop, then so be it. That is the inherent point of the trials after all.

Yeah your post was kind of an inspiration for this lol.

And with older trials, my main point about old trials is how they did the job, they differentiated legends from average people, not the other way round like current did, even if they were worse.