Nerfing in Sasuke

[Deleted]

Why do they nerf stage 3 it’s supposed to be people overcoming the impossible when nerfed it takes away the achievement I feel and people give 27 s*** for nerfing but praise rest bar after ucch even though that nerf more than 27

[Paragus]

Adding the bars in 34 and 35 wasn't that bad. Not even Morimoto could do the Cliffhanger, VL, and Pipe Slider without resting.

[tns8597]

27 is the obvious answer here.

26 didn't really nerf Stage 3 that much. Yes, it replaced the brutal Floating Boards with the forgettable Cycle Road thing, and lowered the third ledge of the UCH, but they also made the Roulette Cylinder harder and the UCH modification made the transition to the fourth ledge more difficult I'd say. So overall 26's Stage 3 was barely any easier than 25.

34 and 35 were definitely necessary; I wouldn't call those modifications 'nerfing' so much as preventing Sasuke from going down a hole of disappointing results year after year due to a ridiculously OP Stage 3. They backtracked on linking the UCCH+VLK because after 34's results they realized that no one was going to clear the combo for at least another 4-5 tournaments, and eventually fans would get bored of the same results and stop watching. Besides, even with the green resting bar both the UCCH and VLK have taken out a large number of competitors on their own. It makes Stage 3 a 'realistic' level of hard and therefore more exciting because you know someone might actually clear.

27 I think was an embarrassment on the whole (except for Stage 2). They replaced the Roulette Cylinder-Doorknob Grasper combo with.... the Arm Bike? They moved the Flying Bar, which I think would've been an awesome last obstacle as you know someone could fail at any point (it invokes so much suspense on ANW) to the second obstacle, made the cradles wider and reduced it to two transitions. Also the Bar Glider which was basically an easier Pipe Slider .... apart from the UCH still being there and the Chain See-Saw, this is honestly one of the most underwhelming Stage 3s I've ever seen. Pure marketing bs to try and get someone to Kanzen.

[Deleted]

Aug 16, 2020 5:27:28 GMT -5 tns8597 said:

27 is the obvious answer here.

26 didn't really nerf Stage 3 that much. Yes, it replaced the brutal Floating Boards with the forgettable Cycle Road thing, and lowered the third ledge of the UCH, but they also made the Roulette Cylinder harder and the UCH modification made the transition to the fourth ledge more difficult I'd say. So overall 26's Stage 3 was barely any easier than 25.

34 and 35 were definitely necessary; I wouldn't call those modifications 'nerfing' so much as preventing Sasuke from going down a hole of disappointing results year after year due to a ridiculously OP Stage 3. They backtracked on linking the UCCH+VLK because after 34's results they realized that no one was going to clear the combo for at least another 4-5 tournaments, and eventually fans would get bored of the same results and stop watching. Besides, even with the green resting bar both the UCCH and VLK have taken out a large number of competitors on their own. It makes Stage 3 a 'realistic' level of hard and therefore more exciting because you know someone might actually clear.

27 I think was an embarrassment on the whole (except for Stage 2). They replaced the Roulette Cylinder-Doorknob Grasper combo with.... the Arm Bike? They moved the Flying Bar, which I think would've been an awesome last obstacle as you know someone could fail at any point (it invokes so much suspense on ANW) to the second obstacle, made the cradles wider and reduced it to two transitions. Also the Bar Glider which was basically an easier Pipe Slider .... apart from the UCH still being there and the Chain See-Saw, this is honestly one of the most underwhelming Stage 3s I've ever seen. Pure marketing bs to try and get someone to Kanzen.

35 is most cause it’s not about how much you like it it’s about how easier you make it the difference between 26 and 27 wasn’t anywhere near as much as 34 to 35 cause of the combo which would have been awesome if someone beat it instead we got oh someone beat it cause we put a rest bar in yaaaay nerfing is about dumbing down which is what it was also stage 2 after 27 sucks

[TCM]

SASUKE like any other Ninja show nerfs and buffs each tournament accordingly to whether production was satisfied with the results of the previous tournament. And in the case of 27, two straight tournaments in the same spot halfway into the course, plus Monster9 was going through internal troubles -- they probably eased it off in case the show died just to go away on a high note. Same with the changes throughout 34 and 35 -- fans actually like watching variety in results.

[tns8597]

The reason they completely nerfed 27 was that initially that was meant to be the final ever SASUKE tournament so they wanted to end it on a high note by someone achieving victory. There was no valid reason otherwise because the results of 26 with respect to the UCH were better than 25, so I reckon someone would've cleared it in 27 even if the obstacles preceding it were kept the same, given how easily those who cleared it did so.

I don't mind a few modifications here and there (like moving the third ledge in 26) but 27's Stage 3 was so blatantly nerfed on every level; as I said, replacing two of the most interesting and grueling first obstacles with an obstacle that was removed after SASUKE 8 for being too easy! The Chain See-Saw was the only good addition to the revised course imo.

It's not like they've ever nerfed Stage 3 after a couple of Cliffhanger fails here and there; think SASUKE 18-20, where no one got past the Shin-Cliffhanger but they kept the course exactly the same because they knew someone would beat it eventually.

[GlobalNinjaFan]

Sasuke 27 was quite literally "nerf or nothing". They believed the show was gonna die, and was either gonna go out on a high or low note. They wisely chose the former.

[TCM]

Aug 17, 2020 14:11:43 GMT -5 tns8597 said:

The reason they completely nerfed 27 was that initially that was meant to be the final ever SASUKE tournament so they wanted to end it on a high note by someone achieving victory. There was no valid reason otherwise because the results of 26 with respect to the UCH were better than 25, so I reckon someone would've cleared it in 27 even if the obstacles preceding it were kept the same, given how easily those who cleared it did so.

I don't mind a few modifications here and there (like moving the third ledge in 26) but 27's Stage 3 was so blatantly nerfed on every level; as I said, replacing two of the most interesting and grueling first obstacles with an obstacle that was removed after SASUKE 8 for being too easy! The Chain See-Saw was the only good addition to the revised course imo.

It's not like they've ever nerfed Stage 3 after a couple of Cliffhanger fails here and there; think SASUKE 18-20, where no one got past the Shin-Cliffhanger but they kept the course exactly the same because they knew someone would beat it eventually.

Kudari Lamp Grasper and Devil Steps replaced Arm Bike (so there's precedence of them using the obstacle past Sasuke 8) and Curtain Swing which were objective buffs compared to what preceded it, and Climbing Bars were replaced by Sending Climber in the back half in 19. 20 was where there were no changes but that was because no one got to try them in 19 -- and Levi mentioned that Sending Climber's rules dictated hands only, and given the smaller artifacts compared to the change to Hang Climbing in 21, was probably not possible and they even realized that given the change the following tournament.

You're comparing to a situation in which they had feedback (no, two ledges further is not significant progress when the issue the prior tournament was no one getting there) and make a call based on maximizing the chance of ending on a more positive note

[tns8597]

Respectfully I disagree for the following reasons:
- The Arm Bike directly followed the Arm Rings thus making it harder in 18, whereas in 27 it was just the first obstacle and replaced a brutally hard combo that I felt was the best ever start to the Third Stage.
- I think the Curtain Swing was maybe meant to be easier than it’s predecessor purely because they wanted to see the Shin-Cliffhanger get attempted. Despite one obstacle being slightly easier, 18’s Stage 3 was still significantly harder than 17’s, whereas almost every aspect of 27’s Stage 3 was pathetically easy compared to 26 or 25, and I don’t think that can be justified beyond trying to make sure someone achieves Kanzenseiha.
- I do think two ledges is significant progress as well. In 25, no one made it to the third ledge. In 26, someone almost made the fifth ledge. Given that there are 6 ledges, In 27 as a result, I reckon even with the preceding half of the course kept the same, someone like Yuuji or Ryo could’ve cleared it especially as they didn’t show any signs of struggle on the obstacle.
- What you said about 21 was true; but again this was one obstacle out of 8 that was slightly toned down, and also bear in mind that during this era we were getting far fewer clears. In 25-27 we were getting far more Stage 1 or 2 clears, thus increasing the chance that someone would’ve been able to clear the UCH even with no modifications. Think what you like but I don’t think there has been ever such a massive nerf across the entire stage compared to 27’s.

Sorry for the long essay; and yes I am very bored hence why I put a lot of thought into this.

[dyer]

27 was definitely the worst but for some of the obstacles themselves in terms of nerfs or changes or just bad,

- Hariyama (Its only the final obstacle of the Third Stage in SASUKE 1 but anyone could have cleared this unless you intentionally tried to fail it. Happy to have the much harder Pipe Slider following after)

- Hang Move (One of the worst obstacles of all time in the Third Stage. Its just the Goren Hammer in a much smaller form except you can use your hands and feet on them and don't have to dodge)

- Jumping Bar Nerf in 16 (I don't think it was necessary to reduce the bars from 6 to 4. I think the original version could have returned for Shin-SASUKE as well)

- Curtain Swing in 18 (Apparently it was supposed to have 7 curtains reading the wikipedia instead of the 4 we saw in action? That's would have been interesting to see)

- Climbing Bars altered in 18 (Was nothing special, all they did was change it so that competitors had to climb it at a greater angle. They could have split it to make it more interesting (like the Vertical Limit Kai?))

- Sending Climber to Hang Climb Change in 21 (Not really the same obstacle since they were both different in a way but it would have been interesting to see the Sending Climber in action just to see if it was possible to clear it with the hands only)

- Final Ring to Gliding Ring Change in 21 (I might be misremembering this but if I recall Levi mentioned it was supposed to be the ring version of the Pipe Slider where you were supposed to force the ring down the track like Makoto Nagano did instead of gliding it down? Not to mention on the wikipedia it says that Hatsuta Keisuke announced it as Final Ring when Nagano failed the obstacle. Would have been nice to compare it to the Flying Bar in terms of which is harder if they kept it as it is)

- Swing Circle to Jumping Ring Nerf in 27 (Not really much needs to be said here. I know they wanted a winner but the nerf alone makes the Jumping Ring also one of the worst obstacles of all time in the Third Stage)

- Rope Junction and Bungee Rope Climb (Not sure what these two obstacles were supposed to accomplish seeing that no one failed either one of them)

There's probably more obstacles that were bad but I think most of the changes could have been kept in their original form minus the Sending Climber.