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Post by jfeathe on Jan 19, 2010 15:02:34 GMT -5
The producers originally made the time limit for 18-24's final stage a bit too lenient.
The question is, will they do this again?
The harder you make the final stage, the more time you need to allot. The problem with a high time limit is that there is a bigger chance someone will crush the Final Stage the first time they try.
For example, let's say the new final stage is comprised of 3 obstacles: 15 meter Spider Climb, 15 meter Heavenly Ladder, and a 10 meter G-Rope. They would probably allot around 15 seconds for the Spider Climb, 20 seconds for the ladder and 25 seconds for the rope. That would make the Final Stage 60 seconds.
If someone was just a bit faster that each of the projections: 14 secs, 19 secs, 24 seconds, they would have destroyed the Final Stage with around 4 seconds to spare.
This is why they need to go back to a 30 second final stage. If Yuuji did in 22 what he did in 24, he would cleared with 8.5 seconds left.
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Post by YoDaUO on Jan 19, 2010 16:34:23 GMT -5
i think the new final stage will be spider climb, ladder, rope. I think it will be as tall as last time but only a 30 sec time limit.
Or just go back to the sasuke 1-4 final stage. That looks like the hardest one and that is what started sasuke.
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supersheep
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Post by supersheep on Jan 19, 2010 17:57:19 GMT -5
They already more or less said they are going to try to make the multi rope approach work. They should have enough testers to get the time limit right.
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scnoi1217
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Post by scnoi1217 on Jan 19, 2010 18:16:28 GMT -5
I agree with what your saying. A good example would probably be the First Stage of Shin-SASUKE. In 5-17, every tournament had people that cleared but were very close to timing out, making for great excitement and drama. In Shin-SASUKE, most tournaments didn't have that. 18, 20, 23, 24, you could even argue 22. Most really low clearing times were because people were just slow on the Rope Ladder. Only Brian Orosco's clear in 21 could be classified as really exciting because he actually MADE UP time on the Rope Ladder. Most tournaments though didn't have that exciting clear such as Jordan in 8 or Akiyama in 11.
So I'd agree that the time limit be made hard and even close to impossible like v2's final stage. Also, I think 30-35 would probably be the most time I would want for a Final Stage. I'd more like to see a sprint to the top rather than a long and hard one, like Viking's for example.
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Post by VenusHeadTrap on Jan 20, 2010 5:38:05 GMT -5
This is why they need to go back to a 30 second final stage. If Yuuji did in 22 what he did in 24, he would cleared with 8.5 seconds left. But... he... didn't. If Nagano did in 7 what he did in 17 he would have cleared with you get my point.
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Post by SRW on Jan 20, 2010 6:08:33 GMT -5
The reason the final stage was 40 seconds in shin sasuke is because it was fundamentally impossible to clear in 30 seconds you cannot do a ladder fast as a spider climb. I would have made it 35 myself, 40 wasnt that bad I mean a load still failed it before Yuuji stepped it up so it obviously wasn't as simple as it looked.
I do admit though in this era I want something that is a KILLER finale this time.
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arsenette
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Post by arsenette on Jan 20, 2010 11:18:18 GMT -5
They get their times based on how the testers do (and then after that how the other competitors do once they get there). They've always done it that way. I don't see why they won't do it again that way. Even Kunoichi's timer was as high as it was because they had a poor tester going friggin' slow. If they had another tester who was faster they would have made the time slower. Even after Yuuji's 45 second failure they lowered it because they realized then it was too lenient. Still.. it's easy to Monday morning quarterback something once you saw it. They have to go with what they have and then adjust accordingly.
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Post by VenusHeadTrap on Jan 20, 2010 12:27:33 GMT -5
The reason the final stage was 40 seconds in shin sasuke is because it was fundamentally impossible to clear in 30 seconds you cannot do a ladder fast as a spider climb. I would have made it 35 myself, 40 wasnt that bad I mean a load still failed it before Yuuji stepped it up so it obviously wasn't as simple as it looked. I do admit though in this era I want something that is a KILLER finale this time. I agree about Urushihara and the final stage, but even more on how killer the final should be next time, the whole course really. I want back that 18-19 vibe where it just seemed like the end to the course was always so far away/undoable.
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Lennon
Levi Meeuwenberg
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Post by Lennon on Jan 20, 2010 18:51:49 GMT -5
The reason the final stage was 40 seconds in shin sasuke is because it was fundamentally impossible to clear in 30 seconds you cannot do a ladder fast as a spider climb. I would have made it 35 myself, 40 wasnt that bad I mean a load still failed it before Yuuji stepped it up so it obviously wasn't as simple as it looked. I do admit though in this era I want something that is a KILLER finale this time. I agree about Urushihara and the final stage, but even more on how killer the final should be next time, the whole course really. I want back that 18-19 vibe where it just seemed like the end to the course was always so far away/undoable. Which is funny because people back then were complaining it was too hard. And now complaining it's too easy.
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Post by Badalight on Jan 20, 2010 21:54:43 GMT -5
I don't ever recall saying stages 3-4 were hard, even back then ^ Stages 1 and 2, that was different, but I've always thought the new stage 3 and 4 were a bit easier than the old ones. Considering it's shin Sasuke you'd assume it'd atleast be the same difficulty if not harder.
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lars072
Jessie Graff
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Post by lars072 on Jan 20, 2010 22:46:44 GMT -5
I don't ever recall saying stages 3-4 were hard, even back then ^ Stages 1 and 2, that was different, but I've always thought the new stage 3 and 4 were a bit easier than the old ones. Considering it's shin Sasuke you'd assume it'd atleast be the same difficulty if not harder. Yep- stages 3 and 4 were harder in SASUKE 14-15 (maybe even 16-17) than in the shin-SASUKE era IMO. Maybe the producers need to look at that fact when redesigning the course.
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Post by SRW on Jan 21, 2010 8:02:19 GMT -5
I think the final stage in shin sasuke was about the same difficulty as the version 2 one well once they got the time right I still would have gone for 35 but whatever I wanted to see more people try it in all honesty but just goes to show it can be beaten at anytime.
I hope the new tower is 30M or more high now it needs to be raised I also hope it still looks like a xmas tree with all the fancy lights and colours lol but with a Killer challenge.
IMO VER 2 and VER 3 were about the same difficulty wise when the time was right anyway definatly not much in it really and to be fair the amount of time it took for version 2 to be beat it was hard enough anyway, But this time I think it has to be significantly harder than anything they have done in the past.
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Post by jfeathe on Jan 21, 2010 21:41:44 GMT -5
The 40 second final stage was perfect. All I'm saying is that with a higher time limit, it's possible there will be a repeat of 22 (or even an unexpected clear.)
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Post by TCM on Jan 21, 2010 23:40:51 GMT -5
I hope the new tower is 30M or more high now it needs to be raised I also hope it still looks like a xmas tree with all the fancy lights and colours lol but with a Killer challenge. I understand the want of a more difficult final stage, but you seem to be underestimating how tall 30 meters actually is. That's around 98 feet (adding the distance between the goal and the topmost decoration that would be 100+ feet) There's a reason 1. they only have them move up 23M, 2. it was only increased a half meter (approx a foot) from 22.5 to 23). It's all a matter of safety, not just for the competitors, but for the poor guys who have to build and take down the dammed thing. Maybe you'll see 24 or 25 meters. MAYBE. But NO WAY anything past that.
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Post by wolf4537 on Jan 22, 2010 2:25:21 GMT -5
They should make a new final stage like 24 except have it be 30 or 35 seconds in my opinion. But they really need something new and exciting plus also something very difficult.
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Post by awee1975 on Jan 22, 2010 2:37:33 GMT -5
It is best if the multiple ropes idea work...if that can't work out, there is always an easy way out...single rope, same height...time will be the killer...40 secs / 35 seconds?
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Post by SRW on Jan 22, 2010 7:08:23 GMT -5
The 3 rope transfer is ultimatly the one we all hoping for but as I said further up the tower would have to be significantly taller to accomodate it and so all the ropes are good lengths.
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lars072
Jessie Graff
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Post by lars072 on Jan 22, 2010 7:19:29 GMT -5
TBH, I don't really think the producers should be too concerned about the final stage. I mean if the new course is very difficult and challenging, then no one will even make the final for quite some time. It took 5 competitions before someone made the final after Nagano's win, so it should (in theory) be the same situation here.
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Post by artyfowljr on Jan 22, 2010 16:06:10 GMT -5
hmm, I have to disagree. Look at what happened with Yuuji: they realized the time limit was lenient only when a competitor nearly won even without a great rope climb. That mustn't happen again, IMO. Plus, if it wasn't for the Grinding Ring...well, that's another story. I think they should work on every stage. And I so damn hope they're able to bring in the Spider Climb+3 ropes thing.
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Post by SRW on Jan 22, 2010 17:10:51 GMT -5
You cannot not make sure the final stage is set ready - someone could get there at anytime even right away especially if theres design flaws in some of the new obstacles which allow them to be skanked lol.
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