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Post by Matt Midoriyama on Oct 26, 2017 1:47:03 GMT -5
I understand that the spin offs do not have the number and quality of athletes that Sasuke and ANW have. And I understand that the money is not there for a whole epic ANW sized series. But I do think there are a lot of improvements the spin offs need to make in order to get to the next level.
Ninja Warrior should be about the finals. The real 4 stages. I do not like only 15 competitors making the final for a start. 100 should be the number.
Stage 2 and 3 should be separated. By all means make them easier than Sasuke or ANW stage 2+3 but to a decent level. A good aim would be 30 reaching s2 and 10 reaching s3. Only an elite athlete reaching s4 but it should be doable if everything goes right for a top top competitor.
The heats are too tough with the limit on only 15 fastest the furthest. If they want to engage the audience I would perhaps just do 2 highlights programs from qualifying (all on same course) to cram in the best inspirational stories, the epic runs and the big fails. Top 200 through to the semis.
Then just straight into the semi finals. Say 4 semifiinals of 50 with top 25 going through.
2 episodes for stage 1 and then the grand final.
ANW has shown this sort of format works. They have tweaked it over the years so why do the spin offs try to reinvent the wheel?
Using the same kind of format the show can go on tweaking the level of difficulty to the standard of competitor. Hell the number of episodes can be fixed to how popular the show is. Some shoes could skip the heats and semis all together and jump straight into the finals. That is a tried and trusted formula as well!
Anyone feel the same?
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defaro
Paul Anthony Terek
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Post by defaro on Oct 26, 2017 6:13:00 GMT -5
I actually likes the indonesian course . 2 trials / qualifers stages (challenge & warrior) and then the top 100 moving on the semifinal stage 1 (aka stage 1) then semi 2 (stage 2), final (stage 3), and midoriyama
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Post by Philip on Oct 26, 2017 17:27:01 GMT -5
Less than half of the 100 on any given Sasuke are actual quality athletes though. I get what you are saying however.
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arsenette
Administrator
Rambling Rican
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Post by arsenette on Oct 26, 2017 18:29:23 GMT -5
None of the spin offs have guidelines - just money on the dotted line. As such TBS doesn't impose what the shows look like. Most are ANW clones anyway and even ANW is not a clone of Sasuke. All decisions are made by the local companies that buy the license for their region and very few want outside help. They want to "tailor" them to the local scene and each of them have a "bright idea" as to what they think their populace wants to see. That's how you got the disaster that was Ninja Warrior Turkey.... So while I agree that some uniformity would be nice, there isn't any because there is no universal template. Some countries want the regionals for ANW, some just want Sasuke, some want ANW and some want Sasuke trials.... each with their own flavor and varying budget and since they now think because of ANW that a revolving door of people is a good thing.. you get a glut of non-athletes lining up to be on television.
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defaro
Paul Anthony Terek
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Post by defaro on Oct 27, 2017 0:48:10 GMT -5
What is so bad with nw turkey? I don't know the nw turkey
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kianmike
Satō Hiromichi
Hype will be real when the full Ninja Machine comes out.Just saiyan.
Posts: 230
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Post by kianmike on Oct 27, 2017 13:55:36 GMT -5
What is so bad with nw turkey? I don't know the nw turkey Long story short,production allowed the competitors unlimited tries so that production got whatever result they wanted.It's as simple as that.
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Post by Matt Midoriyama on Oct 27, 2017 23:57:05 GMT -5
What is so bad with nw turkey? I don't know the nw turkey Long story short,production allowed the competitors unlimited tries so that production got whatever result they wanted.It's as simple as that. Ooh that sounds nasty. Did they show this on air?
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Post by RiderLeangle on Oct 28, 2017 0:34:31 GMT -5
What is so bad with nw turkey? I don't know the nw turkey Long story short,production allowed the competitors unlimited tries so that production got whatever result they wanted.It's as simple as that. Actually it's worse than just that, they wanted good results so they forced everyone to practice all the obstacles over and over. There were numerous injuries because of people trying obstacles they shouldn't have been attempting for their skill level...
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arsenette
Administrator
Rambling Rican
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Post by arsenette on Oct 28, 2017 0:51:56 GMT -5
There's threads for each of them. This shouldn't be an aggregate. Take the time to search for them individually if you have questions. A lot of SMF'ers worked hard to keep them updated.
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Post by sasukestatistician on Oct 28, 2017 2:23:56 GMT -5
Having watched almost all of the spin-offs, I think the current European format is the most entertaining to watch. It's hard to make a series out of the finals alone. Without changing up the obstacles episode to episode, the show would get repetitive. Only two series, Không Giới Hạn - Sasuke Việt Nam and Ninja Warrior العربي, have tried to do this. I felt like both of their first seasons started to drag after a few episodes. Vietnam wasn't as bad since they had a split Stage 1 and got better the next two seasons by decreasing the number of episodes which Stage 1 spanned. The Arabic spin-off was by far the worst of all post 2014 spin-offs. In order to fill the season they had 240 competitors run the course, about the same number of people most of the spin-offs start with. Only 8 made it past Stage 1. The purpose of the qualifiers is to narrow down the field on an easier course. Although most of the spin-offs only have 15-28 people reaching the finals, all of these people are capable of completing Stage 1. The qualifiers allow the audience to see people they can relate to attempt the course and do relatively well while at the same time producing the "quality athletes" for the finals.
A lot of the spin-offs are filmed indoors with limited space so they put Stage 2 and 3 together to maintain a similar level of difficulty as a separated full Stage 2 and 3. The short Stage 2 time limit doesn't allow the competitor to save energy for Stage 3 causing just 2-4 Stage 3 obstacles to take out 27 of the 28 people to make it that far. There just aren't enough quality competitors in most of the spin-off to have a full finals course with 30 people reaching Stage 2 and 10 people reaching Stage 3 without significantly lowering the difficulty or removing time limits. As each spin-off gets more popular, the quality of athletes should increase allowing for fuller courses. We've seen this with Ninja Warrior Germany's second season having an extra qualifying round and more obstacles in both Stage 1 and Stage 3. With Australian Ninja Warrior's popularity and space, hopefully we can see a full finals course next year although I doubt we will.
The heats on most of the spin-offs are no tougher than ANW. Usually the number of people who move on in any qualifying round is around a third of everyone competing. In ANW this is 30-35 of 100 while in AuNW this is 18 out of 50 and in Germany it is 20 out of 60. Again, in order to fill a season without getting repetitive there needs to be qualifiers. The format brought Ninja Warrior from a niche sports show to the world wide reality show it is today. While a lot of people on here would like a "crammed" qualifier with more focus on the finals, that just wouldn't attract as many viewers and without viewers there is no show.
I also don't believe any of the post 2014 spin-offs have a format that is that much different from ANW or Sasuke. Most of them are using the format that worked for ANW, just a scaled down version. Sasuke Ninja Warrior Indonesia has the same format as ANW, Vietnam and the Arabic spin-off have the same format as Sasuke, and all of the European spin-offs and AuNW use a format that stems from ANW. I don't believe ANW has a better format than the current European format. My main issue with ANW's qualifiers is that there is no need for both a city qualifier and city final round anymore. In the city finals, we watch the athletes do the exact same obstacles we saw them do a month prior plus the Salmon Ladder before all but a couple fail the 8th obstacle. The current European format lets us see both the initial qualifier and the final qualifier in the same episode with all different obstacles in the final qualifier. This then leads to a single course semi-final where the best move on to the final. This solves the issue created when certain heats are stacked with better competitors and gives a way of ranking the finalists. Now ANW can't do either of these things because of the fact that they travel to multiple cities and the amount of space they have to work with. Another issue I have with ANW is that while there are about 100 people making it to the finals, we don't see many of their full runs. I'm not saying we should see everyone's run, but if there will only be broadcast time to show 30 Stage 1 runs, 60 competitors would suffice in producing 30 runs of good content. A lot of the spin-offs do in fact show all of the finals runs. In order to show all runs without seeming repetitive, the viewer has to have a connection to the competitors which is created in the qualifiers. ANW barely shows a lot of the finalists in qualifying which allows them to skip over many of the 100 in Stage 1 without a casual viewer feeling like they missed something. ANW though has so many competitors that episodes are full of fast-forwards or cuts which have to include some big names. Having fewer competitors allows all of the advancers screen time and leads to fewer complaints about editing choices.
Now some of the shows have casting and editing issues, but that's a whole other story. When strictly considering the formats, I don't think most of the spin-offs would become more enjoyable to watch by following a format which more closely resembles ANW or Sasuke.
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Post by Philip on Oct 28, 2017 9:09:37 GMT -5
My problem with the European series is that Stages 2 & 3 are just smashed together.
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defaro
Paul Anthony Terek
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Post by defaro on Oct 28, 2017 9:30:17 GMT -5
Things i not likes about the european/australian spin off is their stage 1 not resemble the true stage 1 (sprinting through the course, no too upper body taxing obstacle)
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