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Post by RobbyMac on Jun 18, 2013 14:00:26 GMT -5
I never understand why people blame competitors about anything on the course... they're just prepping for and running the course they're given and it is getting harder over the years... there shouldn't be any hate but if someone wants to be a hater, it goes to the course designers... and there's complaint about how fast Yuuji won after Nagano did and blaming the course (despite it being harder than ever)... guess what, it happens... wouldn't be the first time really, had Nagano not made one of those little stumbles on the Spider Climb in 12, he would have! 8 tournaments after the last Kanzen Seiha, does this mean you should hate Nagano (or anyone)? NO, it's sasuke, it happens... And despite the fact multiple competitors who experienced it first hand say it's harder, you can't just decide what's easier or harder based on just watching and result numbers, unless you actually train and/or have been on a course along with hyper-analyzing every small detail, you can't judge, I train and research like hell (along with that, have experienced a sasuke related course first hand when ANW was in Baltimore and I got to test) and agree 28 was legit hard and 29 already seems more difficult than you give it credit for... You can't sit there and tell me Sasuke 28 stage 1 was harder than Sasuke 27 stage 1. Or with numbers on my side that sasuke 28 (60% clear rate) stage 2 was harder than sasuke 27 (37% clear rate) stage 2. It just wasn't. Is stage 3 much harder? Of course. But last tournament, the final was the same.... They brought back the most difficult final this time. I'm excited for that if people make it there which I still doubt. I don't have to be there. You can go by fail rate on the obstacles. Which is a factual stat. When 29 has 20+ stage 1 clears I'll be right. And where is the proof that everyone said it was harder? I want to see it. You and Elsie can say it all day, hear say doesn't mean anything. I was visual or audio proof.
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Post by wrestlingfan55 on Jun 18, 2013 15:14:36 GMT -5
My problem isn't with Stage 1, it's with Stage 2. I loved Stage 1 from 28 and I thought Stage 2 was awful. It was just so boring to watch and if more people clear this time and it's the same, then it's going to be even more boring.
And I personally think the Wall Lift shouldn't have such a big gap underneath.
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Post by demonix on Jun 18, 2013 19:26:37 GMT -5
Probably the time limits would be: Stage 1: 95.0 Stage 2: 105.0 Final Stage: 30.0 I don't think the final stage time limit will be that short. I am looking more towards 35 seconds. Remember the new tower height is 25m.
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Post by dyer on Jun 18, 2013 19:39:35 GMT -5
Well its about 25m, but the actual height of the spider climb + rope climb is about a meter taller than 7-17's final stage. And its possible to do it at 30 seconds, since nagano would have probably cleared it by less than a second.
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Post by SRW on Jun 18, 2013 19:50:22 GMT -5
the final tower is 23m FFS!!! Its the same as in 18 - present!!
And No Robbymac NAGANO is the greatest ever of all time! Not some guy whos only been there a handful of competitions and won two very similar courses with easier final stages and arguably 3rd bar the UCH. More than Kanzenseiha makes you great - some guy could come in and win 3 SASUKEs in a row, would that instantly make them the best ever?
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Post by RobbyMac on Jun 18, 2013 20:10:56 GMT -5
the final tower is 23m FFS!!! Its the same as in 18 - present!! And No Robbymac NAGANO is the greatest ever of all time! Not some guy whos only been there a handful of competitions and won two very similar courses with easier final stages and arguably 3rd bar the UCH. More than Kanzenseiha makes you great - some guy could come in and win 3 SASUKEs in a row, would that instantly make them the best ever? 1/5 on the final < 2/3 on the final.... Just saying, Yuuji has a better clear record on every stage. He's more dominant and impressive. And yes if some random came in and won 3 in a row, he'd be the best ever. Edit: Since I know you're going to bring this up no he may not have Kanzenseiha'd even after the grinding ring incident. And if he had as much time as Yuuji had in 22 in 23 he would have won again but he didn't. Yuuji will win again if Ryo doesn't first if the course doesn't get more difficult after this competition.
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SKC99
Ishikawa Terukazu
!EKUSAS evol I
Posts: 460
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Post by SKC99 on Jun 18, 2013 21:40:19 GMT -5
WHOA SRW and Robby, we need to talk about the obstacles, NOT the competitors!
From the clip I posted on the Pictures/Recording thread, the Long Jump looks REALLY painful, with an EXTREMELY long runup. I was once glad the steps were FINALLY gone but now, it's getting EVEN worse! I REALLY hope we won't see this in Sasuke 30!
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Post by Philip on Jun 18, 2013 21:53:34 GMT -5
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Post by lostinube on Jun 18, 2013 21:55:50 GMT -5
Obstacle info from TV magazine ザ・テレビジョン (The Television):
1st Stage is 105 seconds with 7 obstacles. Niren Soritatsu Kabe is back (this is official, not picture speculation). The Final Stage is 24 meters in 30 seconds.
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Post by lostinube on Jun 18, 2013 22:00:37 GMT -5
Long Jump is shortened to 3.5 meters for female competitors. Jump Hang Kai is after the Hedgehog.
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Post by RiderLeangle on Jun 18, 2013 22:14:59 GMT -5
I never argued 28's stage 2, that was a failure, but yes I will say 28's stage 1 was significantly harder than 27's...
Step Slider vs Godantobi: Godantobi is harder due to the jump from the platform, Step Slider just needs you to get to the rope (and I can confirm that grabbing the rope on a slider isn't that hard, basing this on Downhill Jump experience), sure you can derp like Li but still rarer.
Rolling Escargot: Almost equal but due to the modified foot holds I'd give a slight edge to 28's but equal
Spin Bridge vs Giant Swing: Spin Bridge by a long shot, way more technical through the whole thing as opposed to a simple up and across. (for fairness when we get there in the course I'll compare 27's Spin Bridge to 28's)
Jumping Spider (27) vs Jump Hang Kai: JHK wins, if it was the 19/26 Jumping Spider that could win but the Kai gives the whip of the catch and the drain of going across is more than Spider Walking (Based on tons of off course spider walking on many widths and surfaces, and net experience on a downwards/across cargo net climb on the Swing Jump (anw original based on Hazard Swing mixed with the Jump Hang)
Halfpipe Attack gets a default win due to shorter stage 1
Soritatsu Kabe vs Ni Ren Soritatsu Kabe: Ni Ren wins, not because it's longer but because the first wall gets to your head, you approach it differently than the second and it screws you up mentally when you get to the normal SK (Note: I realized this by the Navi but was backed up in Nagano's newest interview)
27 vs 28 Spin Bridge: this is a round 2 for 28's in a different spot but 28's wins, smaller balls, bigger spacing, making an already technical obstacle more so...
27 wins on the Tarzan Rope + Rope Ladder due to starting lower.
Time Limit: 28 wins by a longshot, 27 had a ton of padding time but people got through way faster than the designers expected, 5 seconds was too small of a cut with the netless Giant Swing and Spin Bridge replacing the Hazard Swing and original Giant Swing.
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Post by lostinube on Jun 18, 2013 23:26:33 GMT -5
Please note: 27 and 28 were done by two completely different production teams. The RISING team also didn't have access to any of the old obstacles and had to rebuild them from scratch. While people at FOLCOM (Inui's company) and Dreamax were all involved with SASUKE in the past, as far as I can tell, none of them had been involved in the show for a long time. So 27 and 28 are slightly different animals.
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arsenette
Administrator
Rambling Rican
Posts: 16,617
Staff Member
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Post by arsenette on Jun 18, 2013 23:34:19 GMT -5
Anyone manage to strip that video? I'm having all sorts of issues... Send me a PM if you do have it.
Nvm got it
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Post by SRW on Jun 19, 2013 3:55:59 GMT -5
NAGANO>>>> everyone robby the end! I am a Yuuji fan btw but he doesn't need it again I want Nagano winning again or someone new ie RYO or even more so KOJI for the way tbs treated him in 28. Your SASUKE logics are all wrong imo its not all about kanzenseiha the course the person beats does make a difference too. Anyway I apologise for going off topic carry on.
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Post by RobbyMac on Jun 19, 2013 12:49:53 GMT -5
I never argued 28's stage 2, that was a failure, but yes I will say 28's stage 1 was significantly harder than 27's... Step Slider vs Godantobi: Godantobi is harder due to the jump from the platform, Step Slider just needs you to get to the rope (and I can confirm that grabbing the rope on a slider isn't that hard, basing this on Downhill Jump experience), sure you can derp like Li but still rarer. Rolling Escargot: Almost equal but due to the modified foot holds I'd give a slight edge to 28's but equal Spin Bridge vs Giant Swing: Spin Bridge by a long shot, way more technical through the whole thing as opposed to a simple up and across. (for fairness when we get there in the course I'll compare 27's Spin Bridge to 28's) Jumping Spider (27) vs Jump Hang Kai: JHK wins, if it was the 19/26 Jumping Spider that could win but the Kai gives the whip of the catch and the drain of going across is more than Spider Walking (Based on tons of off course spider walking on many widths and surfaces, and net experience on a downwards/across cargo net climb on the Swing Jump (anw original based on Hazard Swing mixed with the Jump Hang) Halfpipe Attack gets a default win due to shorter stage 1 Soritatsu Kabe vs Ni Ren Soritatsu Kabe: Ni Ren wins, not because it's longer but because the first wall gets to your head, you approach it differently than the second and it screws you up mentally when you get to the normal SK (Note: I realized this by the Navi but was backed up in Nagano's newest interview) 27 vs 28 Spin Bridge: this is a round 2 for 28's in a different spot but 28's wins, smaller balls, bigger spacing, making an already technical obstacle more so... 27 wins on the Tarzan Rope + Rope Ladder due to starting lower. Time Limit: 28 wins by a longshot, 27 had a ton of padding time but people got through way faster than the designers expected, 5 seconds was too small of a cut with the netless Giant Swing and Spin Bridge replacing the Hazard Swing and original Giant Swing. The Jumping Spider has done more damage than the Jump Hang ever has....
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Post by RobbyMac on Jun 19, 2013 12:53:37 GMT -5
OK I lied I probably can't beat the long jump..... =(
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Post by YoDaUO on Jun 19, 2013 14:46:11 GMT -5
That is a giant jump... I'm expecting a ton of fails on that
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Post by wrestlingfan55 on Jun 19, 2013 15:42:19 GMT -5
Jeez, maybe it WAS a good thing Yamada didn't compete. Nah I think most if not all the good competitors will pass it. It seems like the testers did "stutter" runs where they hesitated a lot. The only one I fear on it is Nagano. Dude is short.
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SKC99
Ishikawa Terukazu
!EKUSAS evol I
Posts: 460
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Post by SKC99 on Jun 19, 2013 15:49:14 GMT -5
Jeez, maybe it WAS a good thing Yamada didn't compete. Nah I think most if not all the good competitors will pass it. It seems like the testers did "stutter" runs where they hesitated a lot. The only one I fear on it is Nagano. Dude is short. Actually I don't think it's about height. I think it's about how you run into the obstacle! That runup REALLY needs to be shorter! People can REALLY lose concentration by running a long way before jumping!
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Post by SasukeForever on Jun 19, 2013 16:27:27 GMT -5
All they need is a Space Mountain tunnel for the Long Jump run up. Otherwise it's perfect!
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