Our ratings have fallen and they can't get up!

[lostinube]

The SASUKE competitor list thread is getting bogged down by people (including me) talking about ratings so..

Yes, the ratings have fallen the last two competitions. Factors could be:

- The show has been going on for a long time and older fans have been dropping off with no significant amount of newer fans in sight to replace them.

- The show is being run against a popular show (Quiz Hexagon) that caters to some of the same audience (people who like seeing comedians and celebrities do...stuff) and crushes them in the ratings. The Wednesday time slot is a revolving spot on the TBS schedule and is the easiest time to put in a show at the last minute.

- The four hour format is too long. It's nice for us as fans but the casual viewer is going to be channel flipping and frankly, if they've seen the show before and only want to know if someone finishes the course they only need to watch the ending.

- The harder course has turned viewers off. Unless you really really like Yuuji Washimi and Koji Yamada, 19 would have been a disappointment. Thankfully that show was only two hours long.

- Lack of support by TBS in the form of commercials or any sort of advertising.

Solutions?

[scnoi1217]

Moving the broadcast date to something other than Wednesday might be good. I'm not sure how the ratings compare, but would a show like this have better ratings on the weekend, or at least a different week night?

I agree that having Sasuke go up against Quiz Hexagon is a bad idea, and it has happened twice already. If Sasuke was the main show on Wednesday (or any other day) I think the ratings would definitely be higher.

Do you think the ratings would be significantly better if the number of viewers watching online was somehow counted for? Because for that one person hosting TBS on livestation, 100s (maybe 1000s) of people are watching it live.

Are you sure that the harder course is turning off viewers? I know from a ratings standpoint 18 was significantly higher than any of the Sasuke tournaments after it. Maybe that was just curiosity by the casual viewers.

I agree that TBS needs to do more to promote Sasuke. I thought Sasuke 21 was a lot better than 20's advertising and before 21 they had that Sasuke festival among other things. Maybe TBS should make commercials before the actual taping, so at least the casual person knows that the next Sasuke broadcast is coming in a few weeks, instead of a days. It would give them time to hype up the broadcast. They also could have one of the All-Stars (such as Nagano or Yamada) go on a TBS talk show and promote the show. At least that would get the word out there that Sasuke is soon.

Finally, I do think splitting the broadcast from one 4 hour broadcast to two 2 hour broadcasts might be a good idea (similar to how JET TV does it). However, I don't know how that would fit into TBS's schedule. That would give time for people to comment and react to the first half of the broadcast, and get people excited for the rest. Plus, the casual fan can only tune into the 2nd week to see who goes the furthest.

[lostinube]

A different weeknight depends on the schedule. If it ends up running against a drama season finale or a special of a popular show (like how Hexagon was) the ratings could dip even more.

I think if DOORS 2008 had switched with SASUKE (which would result in SASUKE on a Sunday) both shows might have done a little bit better.

I really think people gave up hope prior to 17, were surprised that Nagano finished the course (the 17th only garnered a 14.7), came back during 18 (17.5) and realized that it would be more of the same but harder and no one was going to finish the course any time soon and haven't come back yet. The Yuuji/Koji show (15.2) would have driven home that point.

It's possible (actually, I think it's probable) that Nagano reaching the penultimate obstacle will get people watching again and ratings will go up for the next broadcast.

I'm not an advocate of the split show. I just don't think that four hours works. Three hours is the max the show really should go. The Pro Sportsman No. 1 show can go for four hours because it has more star power than SASUKE. Seeing the STQers was great for all of us but the majority of the country never saw SASUKE Maniac so they would have been seeing them for the first time. There were probably people who were like "Who? Bring on Mr. SASUKE!"

I think the one thing that would solve a lot of the promotion problems would be for TBS to take the plunge and do another Kinniku Banzuke show. Just half-an-hour like SASUKE Maniac would be fine. It's not like SASUKE Maniac was restricted to only SASUKE. Getting all synergetic up in the house and having the SASUKE All-Stars do non-Monster 9 promotional work is a nice idea. I think a show hosted by Wakky and his Penalty partner with occasional cameos by the Muscle Musical people, the Muscle Queen competitors, the All-Stars and keeping up with the STQers (whom I really think the powers that be want to turn into the New Generation All-Stars) once a week nationally on a Saturday night is a cheap viable option.

[RiderLeangle]

I definitly think that they should move it to a weekend instead of a Wedsneday. And yes, advertisment would be a good thing, they should make comercials before the filming using testers and stuff from previous new competitions (19, 20 and 21 have plenty of good runs for commercials), then after the filming they can make a new competition with new viewers, I mean that commercial for 21 they had in Sasuke Navi, Mania and right before the broadcast was good, now if they ran that all the time then that would be a good idea for them, I mean look how often G4 has been showing their Ninjafest 3 commercials, Sure its just the Sasuke 20 commercial with some added footage not from the runs but this proves my point furthur of what a pre-Sasuke commercial could be like (G4 has no excuse though, 21 showed in September).
And I definitly think they should get more star power (No, not the kind you get in Guitar Hero that you tilt the guitar to use) for the competitors, its mostly comedians and athletes, sure those groups have alot of fans, but they aren't everyones taste so that has to be a factor too.

Although I'm hopeful because of the results after 21 that more people watch, I mean look, 18 has all 3 people who made it to stage 3 fail the Cliffhanger, then 19 only 2 people make it to stage 2 and fail the second obstacle, 20 has 3 people make it, one fails the stick slider, one person makes it to stage 3 (and then fails the cliffhanger), and Nagano fails the Downhill Jump, but 21, 9 people make it to stage 2 (3 All Stars, 3 Foriegners, 1 Olympian, 1 Athlete and 1 Muscle Musical member (I think that Nakata is still in that, I might be wrong but I'm pretty sure I'm right)) and 3 of those people pass, Both the All Stars who pass make it past the Cliffhanger and Nagano makes it to the last obstacle, Thats gotta be a good sign for 22s ratings right there.


And I don't know what Quiz Hexagon is, all I know is its not good for Sasuke's Ratings, so just move the time slot of Sasuke so its not on against that, hell, even Thursday would be better than Wedsneday as far as I can tell (I may be wrong as I do not know Japanese TV Schedules).

So with that being said, More advertising, better time slot, more celebrities (but don't over-do it to the point its more celebrities with no chance than actual competitors), and don't go on against other popular shows (Thats right TBS, DON'T assume everyone has a DVR)

[obakemono]

The thing with the program length is that Sasuke is getting longer. Deep runs of the first stage take up a good two minutes each, and this makes up the bulk of the program. I think three hours would be workable if they cut out a lot of the filler in the second and third stages, which honestly went on for entirely too long in 21, and has bordered on ridiculous in the past. Then again, JET can pull off pretty good two hour edits, so I suppose TBS could if they toned down the HYPE[/b] and (gasp) cut more runs.

Better advertising is the main thing to get ratings up, though, and the best way to do this would be Ube's suggestion of a new Banzuke-type show. I don't see this happening, though. Perversely, I think this would only come as a result of Sasuke getting better ratings.

[arsenette]

Sasuke 21 I hope brings back viewers that were lost before because the course was too hard. (Hard core viewers like us will continue to watch it so we can't confuse us with the casual person flipping channels).

Definately moving it away from that Quiz show so it's basically on it's own would be best.

Cutting it back down to 3 hours is probably going to help as well.

I think though Sasuke 21 had an interesting mix. For the first time in a few years you had a bunch of people going to the second stage. Some new, some old which I think was awesome. And we had a 3rd stage in .. 2 years? Something like that. Math is soooooo not happening right now..

Definately they need to advertise more.. do more of those goofy fluff shows I adore blogging about and definately exploit the overseas market! The more people know about the show the more it can expand. From everything I've been hearing.. most people in Japan don't even know it's on!

[scnoi1217]

The thing is, I think cutting down the broadcast is a bad idea if your going to cut down the time from 4 hours to 3 hours. I mean, look how many people are complaining because (insert name here) wasn't shown at all in 21, even though we knew they were there. That's going to piss off a lot of the hardcore fans because one of their favorite lesser known competitors wasn't shown. Plus, would a decrease of an hour really do much? The casual fan isn't going to sit through 3 hours, they are going to watch for a few moments and then change the channel. So I'm not sure that an hour removal would do anything except piss off people that want to see their favorites compete.

[lostinube]

Yes but the people complaining are hard core fans who will, quite honestly, b**** about a lot of things regardless of how it's done. The average viewer will just shake it off. Cutting the show makes it more accessible to the newer viewer - they don't explain things anyway so the only choice is to keep the show moving at a brisk pace that ups the excitement.

[RiderLeangle]

Keep the between run stuff to a minimum is what you're saying?
That version of Sasuke exists, in america, with subtitles and the screen blocked, and profiles and replays dubbed, its called Ninja Warrior, and you're not missing much from being in japan Ube.

[lars072]

Oct 22, 2008 16:19:59 GMT -5 scnoi1217 said:

The thing is, I think cutting down the broadcast is a bad idea if your going to cut down the time from 4 hours to 3 hours. I mean, look how many people are complaining because (insert name here) wasn't shown at all in 21, even though we knew they were there. That's going to piss off a lot of the hardcore fans because one of their favorite lesser known competitors wasn't shown. Plus, would a decrease of an hour really do much? The casual fan isn't going to sit through 3 hours, they are going to watch for a few moments and then change the channel. So I'm not sure that an hour removal would do anything except piss off people that want to see their favorites compete.

I agree, but it depends a lot on how many competitors pass the 1st and 2nd stages. Sasuke 19 was shorter because only 2 guys passed the 1st stage and were eliminated shortly thereafter. Can you imagine if they cut Sasuke 21 to 3 hours? Yikes!

JET TV runs a different Sasuke competiton every Saturday and repeats it like 5 times on the weekend. It gives people a lot of choice on the times. Once in a while, they take a break and show Kunoichi or Viking and then switch back a few months later. I can never figure out why TBS only shows Sasuke ONCE and never repeat it. On top of that, they never show previous versions of Sasuke either which, IMO, is plain stupid. If you want to attract customers, you sell the show. With only ONE viewing per season and no previous versions, they are really limiting the fan base and attracting new viewers. They need to attract younger viewers and need to try and get more famous Japanese and foreign athletes to compete to increase ratings. Getting the 2 Olympic wrestlers to compete was a step in the right direction. But young viewers want to see their 'idols,' and sorry but I doubt many of them watch handball.

Here are my thoughts on how to boost ratings...

1. Attract a new young audience by promoting the show during TV programs and on internet sites which these people use.

2. Attract new celebrities and athletes that are more familiar to this age group. Teenagers and youth really listen to their idols and if these people can promote the show and even enter it, that will generate more fans who seem to love and adore these celebrities.

3. Having a GOOD and up-to-date official web site in both Japanese and English which has Sasuke competitor profiles, history, competition results, photos, etc. AND telling people ahead of time when the next competition is and who is competing.

4. Releasing DVDs of Sasuke or at least a Best of Sasuke DVD (ok, maybe more for the die-hard fans).

5. As many of you have said earlier, putting it in a different time slot and maybe on a weekend when more people are able to watch it would make sense to me. This is a no brainer IMO.

6. Having a new group of Sasuke All-stars may work if TBS gets the right competitors and they stick to it like the current All-stars have. We've all enjoyed following the all-stars and they aren't done yet. However, it's time to move on and attract a new and younger fan base.

7. TBS needs to follow JET TV's footsteps and play Sasuke events more often. OK, maybe every week is impossible. But isn't there a time where they can play previous versions of Sasuke? How about showing repeats of the new competition. You are really restricting viewers when you nly show it ONCE on a weeknight during another popular show.

Any thoughts?

[lostinube]

Comparing JET to TBS is not really fair. One is a national network that needs to maintain ratings which means producing new programming on a regular basis. The other is a cable TV station that mainly (I'm not entirely sure) only shows programming produced by others.

TBS can't afford to rerun SASUKE during any time that would make a difference in the ratings. There is no downtime in the Japanese TV schedule ala the rerun season in the US. In between drama seasons (which is when SASUKE is usually shown) is chock-full of new and original programming. Even up until around 1 or 2 AM you still usually end up with original programming. Rerunning SASUKE during Golden Time would be ratings death.

Also, think of SASUKE like any other major sports events. Do they ever replay the Super Bowl in the US? Any games of the World Series?

The best thing they can do is a 30 or 60 minute recap show ala SASUKE Navi only actually broadcast nationally (not only in the Tokyo area).

And for those talking about the four to three hour thing:

18 had six people reach the 2nd Stage and three the 3rd Stage. Broadcast time: Three hours.
17 had eight people reach the 3rd Stage and two the Final. Broadcast time: Three hours.
13 had ten people reach the 2nd Stage, five the 3rd Stage and 1 the Final. Broadcast time: Three hours.

The four hour shows are an anomaly. It made sense for 20 because it was the anniversary but 21 could have still been done in three hours or so. And I'm not saying to cut out the profiles as someone is suggesting. You can still have background information on the more successful but it usually comes at the expense of people in the 1st Stage. Is interesting stuff lost? Of course but that's the way TV works.

[lostinube]

Oh, and I should add that from 2006 to 2008, Golden Time (Prime Time) on Wednesdays has always been a revolving slot which is why SASUKE always shows up there. It's the one place that they can put in any sort of programming without disrupting the rest of the weekly schedule.

[supernovamaniac]

Oh well, replace DOORS next time with Sasuke. Please.

(at the title = GET LIFE ALERT)

[arsenette]

Ube I agree with doing Navi or some type of show once a month or something or something.. or.. open up Sasuke Maniac to a wider audience. I know I enjoyed when they showed Sasuke related events and what the All-stars were doing. With the amount of stuff they have been doing vs. the past I think it'll be something to keep people into who's coming, etc. and build excitement.

[jcdenton]

Oct 22, 2008 10:24:11 GMT -5 lostinube said:

Unless you really really like Yuuji Washimi, 19 would have been a disappointment.

<--- I am a HUGE Washimi fan, but 19 was still the lamest

This is really disheartening about the ratings though, I only a year and half left, that's 3 more competitions until I have a shot at making it

I'll pretty much die if it's canceled anytime soon

[sasuke1247]

I did the math and be on around Sasuke 29/28/30ish. But due to TBS's mistakes it will last till Sasuke 25 or so. And I dont see way your complaining who cares about casual veiwers, THEY'RE NOT GANNA TALK ABOUT IT OR GO TO THE SITE FOR A FEEDBACK. 4 hours is the best thing they could of done. This was the most dramatic/best/best preforming/Yamada preformance so far(beside 18 for yamada. He did half pipe attack with a hurt ankle and he made it worst from the drop on the spider walk. You can tell he had bandages on his leg.)

[lostinube]

Looking back at how the information trickled down, the four hour broadcast was decided BEFORE they even held SASUKE 21. So if no one made it to the 3rd Stage there would have been a lot of filler and that probably would have killed the ratings even more.

I think the short turnaround time between the taping and airing is hurting the show especially with regards to promotion.

[RiderLeangle]

That would suck if it was another 19 and got a 4 hour broadcast.

[joemello]

There is no reason for the broadcast of Sasuke proper to ever be 4 hours. EVER.

Also, do you think that the random Wednesday slot actually hurts TBS in the long run?

[Badalight]

They should have their own 30 minutes ninja warrior like episodes that they show. Like 1 tournament a week or something, leading up to Sasuke 22.

This way they'll gain more fans, and just like that quiz hexagons how, once there is the "Special" 3-4 hour episode on, the new fans will have peaked interests, and maybe even DITCH quiz hexagon.

Because for them, Sasuke is new and exciting, Quiz hexagon may be cool but this is the new deal to them right? They ar ejust getting into it.

Either way it shouldn't come down to that, because there is no excuse for it showing at the same time as any popular japanese show special.

So if they can make sure there's no competition when it's on, air 30 minute episodes in the 6 months leading up to the competition (Basically taking the spot of Sasuke Maniac) put it in a better time slot, wait about a month after the comp. to air it (More time for promoting), have better promoting like more commercials, Radio interviews with Nagano, and special Sasuke events at muscle park and things like the Maguro Festival in that month of waiting... THAT would increase some ratings.

yeah...